00:40:44 <cyberanger> #startmeeting 00:40:44 <meetingology> Meeting started Fri Aug 3 00:40:44 2012 UTC. The chair is cyberanger. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology. 00:40:44 <meetingology> 00:40:44 <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired 00:40:44 <netritious> ouch 00:41:01 <cyberanger> netritious: high latency too (satellite phone) 00:41:07 <netritious> eeek 00:41:10 <cyberanger> #chair netritious 00:41:10 <meetingology> Current chairs: cyberanger netritious 00:41:19 <cyberanger> wrst: you here? 00:41:37 <cyberanger> #chair wrst 00:41:37 <meetingology> Current chairs: cyberanger netritious wrst 00:42:46 <netritious> I would rather you chair cyberanger, but I'll try if needed. 00:43:27 <cyberanger> netritious: take another look, it's three chairs 00:43:43 <cyberanger> meetingology: has some new tricks the old bot didn't have 00:43:43 <meetingology> cyberanger: Error: "has" is not a valid command. 00:43:59 <cyberanger> and is still new enough to be dumb at moments ^ 00:44:14 <vychune> LOL 00:44:19 <netritious> nice. where /is/ wrst? 00:44:26 <cyberanger> netritious: wrst you & myself are all chairing it 00:44:32 <vychune> im showing away in xchat 00:44:42 <netritious> let's do roll call? 00:44:44 <cyberanger> wrst: attending to family perhaps 00:44:49 <netritious> most likely 00:45:16 <vychune> whered Svpernova09 and orias go? 00:45:33 <vychune> netritious: reping maybe? 00:45:41 <orias> >.> 00:46:27 <vychune> <.< 00:46:29 <cyberanger> netritious: per the blog post... 00:46:32 <cyberanger> # A minimum of six members should be present to hold elections. 00:46:35 <cyberanger> # It is preferable that a minimum of two members from each region attend the elections. 00:47:02 <cyberanger> however, having four is better than some prior meetings 00:47:08 <netritious> Right, and elections doesn't have to happen, but the meeting should. 00:47:29 <netritious> that's why all headers end in (unofficial) 00:47:38 <netritious> on the blog post 00:47:42 <cyberanger> netritious: if elections don't happen, what do you propose, one month extension 00:47:56 <cyberanger> west tn does have enough for it's region though 00:48:22 <cyberanger> lemme see something real quick (over 9600 baud, might not be THAT quick) 00:48:36 <netritious> raise your hand if you're here for the meeting please? 00:48:38 <netritious> o/ 00:48:52 <cyberanger> here 00:49:25 <orias> o/ 00:49:38 <alyawn> lol... here :) 00:50:29 <cyberanger> I happen to know Ubik is out of town today, so he might be more focused on his trip (we'll see) 00:51:13 <cyberanger> Ubik: you here? 00:51:30 <netritious> well there is four :) better than two, and who knows, someone might show up. 00:52:41 <cyberanger> netritious: everyone besides Ubik & Svpernova09 have been idle for over an hour, Svpernova09 over a half and Ubik about a minute 00:53:07 <cyberanger> so... your all west tn, do you want to do any elections on your seat 00:53:30 <cyberanger> I'm neutral, east tn, but there's 3 of you here, so...? 00:53:42 <netritious> we could or we could talk about LoCo biz 00:53:53 <vychune> o/ 00:54:06 <netritious> yes vychune? 00:54:13 <cyberanger> alyawn: remind me, your metro knoxville, yes 00:54:16 <cyberanger> ? 00:54:20 <orias> we can, or just let it be if there's no changes 00:54:20 <alyawn> chattanooga 00:54:30 <vychune> raising hand for presence late sorry 00:54:32 <cyberanger> even better, my area ;-) 00:54:42 <alyawn> heh 00:54:48 <netritious> awesome, and then there was five. 00:54:59 <alyawn> you're the one hogging my bandwidth then :) 00:55:19 <cyberanger> not likely 00:55:47 <cyberanger> netritious: so, no middle, two in east tn, 3 in west, loco biz, your call 00:56:51 <netritious> I motion we postpone elections until we get the minimum (logical yet unofficial) attendees 00:57:36 <netritious> *number of attendees 00:57:37 <cyberanger> netritious: well, when was the last time we've had 6 people 00:57:52 <cyberanger> w4ett's days? more recent? 00:58:11 <netritious> when was the last time we had five? my point being, it's not important I don' think. 00:58:11 <vychune> why not use a different method of voting, that enable absentee votes? 00:58:13 <cyberanger> just asking to grasp if that's a high number, or not 00:58:54 <netritious> ok, how about... 00:58:59 <cyberanger> netritious: if it's not important, why postpone till we have it? 00:59:28 <netritious> So is the motion not carried or...? 00:59:39 <cyberanger> we can postpone it for this meeting at least, if there's a better issue to takle atm 01:00:08 <alyawn> I'm usually available on here, provided I get a ping 01:00:10 <cyberanger> but I can't really second it, if it'll keep getting tabled 01:01:05 <cyberanger> if it's not having 6, I can table it saying "restructing voting rules" or something 01:01:10 <netritious> I think the two w tn poc's are fine. 01:01:54 <netritious> Does anyone have a nomination for w tn point of contact? 01:01:56 <cyberanger> netritious: so, extend current terms one month, to focus on current issues this meeting, is that the motion? 01:02:10 <netritious> currently it is Svpernova09 and orias I believe. 01:02:28 <cyberanger> netritious: that's correct 01:02:33 <vychune> nova and orias are good with me 01:02:50 <cyberanger> they're terms were automatically extended 01:03:05 <netritious> yeah, me to. I thought that if we didn't vote they would serve another term? 01:03:49 <cyberanger> (last election we were short on west tn, so after voting the rest, there was a vote to automatically renew, pending a step down letter or a challenge or something) 01:03:53 <netritious> so yeah, no need to vote I guess? then not really postponing. 01:04:20 <alyawn> sounds logical 01:04:29 <netritious> I motion that we move along lol. 01:04:32 <cyberanger> netritious: so are we extending for the default 6 mo term, or just a one month postpone of elections 01:04:52 <cyberanger> seconded 01:05:39 <cyberanger> (sounds like we're agreed current leadership works for at least a month, worry about next month then) 01:05:59 <cyberanger> any opposed? 01:06:38 <vychune> no 01:06:45 <netritious> no 01:07:46 <cyberanger> [agreed] extend leadership term 01:07:54 <cyberanger> netritious: next item 01:08:19 <cyberanger> ( meetingology, unlike mootbot, is silent, no ack) 01:08:53 <netritious> #topic Increasing attendance to the monthly LoCo IRC meetings, or is it important? 01:09:12 <netritious> meetingology: #topic Increasing attendance to the monthly LoCo IRC meetings, or is it important? 01:09:12 <meetingology> netritious: Error: "#topic" is not a valid command. 01:09:25 * netritious is a chair n00b 01:09:39 <cyberanger> [topic]Increasing attendance to the monthly LoCo IRC meetings, or is it important? 01:09:54 <cyberanger> netritious: syntax change mootbot to meetingology 01:10:08 <netritious> roger. thx cyberanger 01:10:29 <cyberanger> on the one hand, I can't make meetings on thursday anymore (today is an exception that barely happened) 01:10:58 <cyberanger> on the other, not sure it's right to talk about changing something to just the people that made it to the meeting 01:11:09 <netritious> It does seem that receiving reminders does increase attendance, even if it's just a little. 01:11:32 <cyberanger> that and elections has typically drawn more than avg too 01:11:36 <alyawn> Any night other than Thursday would also be better for me 01:11:50 <cyberanger> so I'd like to see that repeat for a normal one 01:12:08 <netritious> cyberanger: I put it to the list, but no one replied with an issue for Thur. nights. 01:12:28 <cyberanger> then there's an issue, as I replied 01:12:33 <cyberanger> and saw others reply 01:12:45 <netritious> I do know that Svpernova09 will be occupied on the first Thu of the month, you and alyawn to now. 01:12:51 <netritious> hm, that's odd. 01:13:16 <cyberanger> (granted, some that replied tripped mailman errors that only I saw, and they didn't repost I guess) 01:14:00 <netritious> hm. seems odd. 01:14:30 <netritious> regardless, you have a point. we shouldn't move a meeting night just b/c the ppl showed, well, showed. 01:14:39 <alyawn> I only received the one email 01:14:50 <vychune> sounds legit 01:14:54 <cyberanger> I've had list issues since I enherited the list from w4ett 01:15:27 <netritious> So weird that it was tested and eighteen replied? 01:15:48 <cyberanger> netritious: becuase the errors weren't pass or fail 01:15:56 <netritious> Back on topic though: How to increase attendance to these meetings? 01:16:08 <netritious> One suggestion is to move the meeting night. 01:16:15 <netritious> Any other suggestions? 01:16:15 <cyberanger> some were members somehow getting the list, but getting flaged as non-members 01:16:25 <cyberanger> others were mis-flagged as spam 01:16:33 <cyberanger> majority made it 01:16:33 <alyawn> Incentives? 01:16:56 <netritious> Ah, yes, that would be good. A reason to come. :) 01:17:29 <netritious> I would like to either use the meeting time to possibly start doing some tutorials, right here in IRC. 01:17:59 <cyberanger> netritious: I think actually when 2 out of 5 say they have issues with thursday, and an additional member (that we know of) has that too, that's enough to make a motion of some kind on it 01:18:12 <alyawn> tutorials such as? 01:18:36 <vychune> apache? 01:18:41 <cyberanger> not to change it outright, but at least find out what works for those who showed 01:18:59 <netritious> alyawn: maybe make suggestions to the list? 01:19:20 <alyawn> Well, maybe we should just defer meeting changes to list 01:19:24 <cyberanger> alyawn: anything a member proposes (within reason, a howto on commiting a federal crime with ubuntu would be bad) 01:19:41 <netritious> alyawn: good point. 01:19:51 <alyawn> ok.. so the primary rule is Ubuntu specific for tutorials? 01:19:56 <netritious> cyberanger: can you get some support on the mailing list issues you are having? 01:20:06 <wrst> sorry i'm late! 01:20:12 <netritious> doesn't mailman allow you to mark something not spam? 01:20:20 <netritious> howdy wrst 01:20:43 <wrst> hey netritious sorry been providing support and also getting ready to install ubuntu for my brother so hopefully that excuses me :) 01:21:00 <netritious> you don't need an excuse wrst 01:21:03 <cyberanger> netritious: not at a rate that helps, considering how much spam lists.ubuntu.com gets 01:21:21 * wrst checks out the informative scrollback 01:22:03 <netritious> cyberanger: is the first Thur of every month the official meeting day for LoCo's? 01:22:10 <cyberanger> I've had to disapprove 350 messages on avg for zero approvals, this month, about 500 disapproved, for 5-10 legit 01:22:22 <cyberanger> netritious: each loco sets it 01:22:29 <vychune> maybe post to the Ubuntu-TN G= some stuff? 01:22:35 <netritious> Looks like we may need another list? 01:22:45 <cyberanger> it's not a loco council thing, it's just what worked back in feb 2009 01:22:57 <netritious> ah k, didn't know. 01:23:03 <cyberanger> and the time was tweaked once for a few (namely jfenn2199 & myself) 01:23:28 <netritious> But still, it concerns me that so many replied to the test, and you say so many replied that need to change the night of the meeting, but none of those came through? 01:23:53 <cyberanger> netritious: the issues are getting support, just fighting time & the rate of spam in the mean time 01:24:33 <netritious> cyberanger: are you the only one that can maintain the list? 01:25:09 <netritious> If you need help managing it, I'd be glad to provide it. 01:25:42 <cyberanger> the issue really boils down to members actually joining the list 01:25:57 <wrst> yeah i could throw my hat in that ring also, i help with the support in an opensource project and the spam can be overwhelming for one person to maintain 01:26:07 <netritious> alyawn: I would think the tutorials need to be Ubuntu centric yes. 01:26:36 <cyberanger> the few others are too few and far between, I maintain it twice daily on avg 01:26:49 <alyawn> netritious, thought so 01:26:50 <wrst> i've gotta go now tend to sleep stuff, but cyberanger, good to see we have doubled attendance from the last meeting!! 01:26:59 <cyberanger> I'll get wrst in on it too (middle tn leadership) 01:27:02 <wrst> sleep stuff for the youn 'un 01:27:27 <wrst> thanks cyberanger... i think 01:27:41 <netritious> ok, sounds good. 01:27:44 <cyberanger> wrst: don't worry, stay focused on lp, I got the list 01:27:58 <cyberanger> we'll just back each other up as we've already done 01:28:00 <cyberanger> as needed 01:28:07 <wrst> ha ha ok cyberanger now that sounds like a plan 01:28:24 <netritious> Eighteen members replied to the test. Only one replied with a issue with Thur nights, and only one other in this meeting. 01:28:42 <netritious> I don't think we need a motion for changing meeting nights, unless you make one cyberanger. 01:28:44 <cyberanger> netritious: two, alyawn Svpernova09 & myself 01:28:58 <netritious> Ah yes, true. 01:29:01 <netritious> So three. 01:29:12 <wrst> netritious: just curious would it work better for people during the daytime we seem to be having more irc activity then at present? 01:29:33 <netritious> Three of eighteen that has signed up to the list and replied to the test. 01:29:35 <cyberanger> I'm making a motion, tutorials as part of every other meeting, and making it a choice between the current day & time, and another day & time 01:29:42 <cyberanger> and putting that on the list 01:29:55 <netritious> Actually I just had a thought. 01:30:14 <cyberanger> (with a clear way to absentee vote too) and approve one or another next meeting 01:30:21 <netritious> There is no reaosn I can't start providing tutorials independently of these meetings. 01:30:34 <cyberanger> that's the motion I propose (but I'm tabling the motion to hear you out) 01:30:41 <netritious> Not at the same time as the meeting of course. 01:31:32 <cyberanger> true, but I think it's spot on, we need to get back to meetups, tutorials, helping on irc, the forums 01:31:45 <netritious> Sure, but I thought the current topic was how to increase attendance? Are we done with that? 01:31:46 <cyberanger> if that's an incentive for some, why deny it 01:31:59 <netritious> I think we ran everyone off. There was traciton now none, lol. 01:32:11 <cyberanger> vychune: still here 01:32:16 <cyberanger> orias: still here 01:32:25 <cyberanger> alyawn: still here? 01:32:26 <alyawn> I think tutorials in a group session could be good, but will need to be time limited 01:32:43 <alyawn> and yes... still here 01:32:45 <netritious> +1 01:32:49 <wrst> alyawn: yep sometimes the meetings can be too long like make you want to shoot yourself long! 01:32:57 <netritious> haha wrst 01:33:06 <wrst> now i really have to go :) 01:33:11 <wrst> not to shoot anyone! 01:33:13 <alyawn> heh... good luck 01:33:20 <cyberanger> yeah... still don't know how to truely resolve that one 01:33:28 <orias> heh 01:33:53 <netritious> cyberanger: I was mainly trying to brainstorm. 01:34:24 <netritious> We have enough here to do that. 01:34:45 <netritious> So sending meeting reminders help. 01:35:02 <alyawn> yes... we need reminders of the reminders 01:35:07 <netritious> Having incentive helps, like sharing information, maybe int he form of tutorials. 01:35:25 <cyberanger> netritious: I follow, but I do think a motion should be made towards that meeting time, some might have been indifferent, and nobody proposed an alternative yet (despite some saying thursday was an issue) 01:35:34 <vychune> o/ 01:35:42 <netritious> you made the motion and no one seconded. 01:35:55 <netritious> vychune: are you seconding? 01:36:00 <cyberanger> I actually tabled it, for discussion 01:36:03 <vychune> no responding 01:36:12 <netritious> Oh lol 01:36:20 <cyberanger> since we don't have that second option, 01:37:00 <cyberanger> alyawn: is a tuesday better? 01:37:22 <alyawn> yes... 01:37:39 <cyberanger> netritious: also, if it's not a vote, don't think we need a second, just an agreement 01:38:05 <netritious> I disagree with changing the regularly scheduled meetings. 01:38:09 <cyberanger> alyawn: say, fourth tuesday 01:38:36 <cyberanger> netritious: I'm not changing it, just setting a second option, so we can get better input on the list & next meeting 01:38:52 <alyawn> any tuesday is fine with me 01:38:57 <netritious> Ah ok, makes complete sense. 01:39:12 <cyberanger> I think if we had first thursday OR forth tuesday, it makes it a choice, people have to pick 01:39:45 <netritious> I think that is adding more complexity than neccessary cyberanger. 01:39:56 <netritious> We can't even get replies to the mailing list. 01:40:12 <netritious> Not in a predictable fashion anyway. 01:41:08 <cyberanger> netritious: I think people saying they can't make it, or it's hard to make it, and offering no alternatives isn't a resolution to the issue 01:41:17 <netritious> So I guess a better question is, if the mailing list is not going to work to communicate to the LoCo members, for wahtever reason, what can be done to rectify the situation? 01:41:24 <cyberanger> agreed on the list 01:41:37 <cyberanger> netritious: the list worked, mostly 01:42:13 <cyberanger> the three issues I saw was it became two threads, due to some replying to the daily archive, others to the actual thread 01:42:41 <vychune> i think the biggest issue is the purpose 01:42:45 <cyberanger> others replied from an address not registered to mailman (but cross checked with lp, were members) 01:42:58 <netritious> vychune: +1 01:43:14 <cyberanger> and the third was...maybe the third was resolved before this thread 01:43:18 <vychune> we have to define the reason we do things 01:43:40 <netritious> These meetings are not getting much accomplished. I feel like we are tlaking in circles here. 01:43:43 <netritious> *talking 01:43:46 <cyberanger> the purpose of a loco is defined 01:43:56 <netritious> true 01:43:58 <vychune> a loco 01:44:08 <netritious> LoCo = Local Community 01:44:09 <cyberanger> but not at a loco level, at the council level 01:44:22 <vychune> but TN's loco may need more definition 01:44:40 <netritious> We, the people here that registered on Launchpad, are Ubuntu LoCo Members 01:44:44 <vychune> cyberanger: or that lol 01:44:55 <vychune> right 01:45:07 <cyberanger> ubuntu loco tennessee members, yes 01:45:20 <cyberanger> members of the tennessee team 01:46:39 <cyberanger> I think on the topic of meeting times, first thursday 8:30 ET 7:30 CT and 4th tues same time, should that go to the list, the adgenda on wp, so on 01:46:58 <cyberanger> to be put to a decision on our next meeting on... 01:47:21 <cyberanger> on the 6th of sept 01:47:26 <vychune> cool 01:47:46 <cyberanger> making that a motion 01:47:48 <vychune> i think a topic sholud be made about getting more activites in here 01:48:00 <netritious> but that put's meetings back to back 01:48:17 <netritious> unless it;s a five week month of course 01:48:25 <netritious> argh this keyboard layout 01:48:42 <cyberanger> netritious: it puts two meetings in one month, but not back to back 01:49:12 <cyberanger> if that was switched, we'd have a meeting on the 6th & 25th 01:49:20 <cyberanger> for one month only 01:49:27 <netritious> the 4th tuesday of the month and the first tues of the followign month is typically back to back 01:49:33 <cyberanger> and we've don that before for elections once 01:49:40 <netritious> *first thur 01:50:07 <cyberanger> this month, this meeting, next month, on the 6th, a vote on which one to hold future meetings 01:50:20 <cyberanger> opt. 1, keep the same, nothing is back to back 01:51:00 <cyberanger> opt. 2, switch, sept 25th, next meeting after is oct. 23rd 01:51:18 <cyberanger> so nothing is back to back (but sept would have two meetings due to the switch) 01:51:20 <netritious> crap, gotta take this call guys. afk 01:52:58 <cyberanger> vychune: agreed, but activities doesn't help some of us attend meetings (if it wasn't for the satphone I'm on, I'd be at work with no internet for this meeting, normally I'm on a work project or at church right now) 01:54:02 <cyberanger> I think we need activities too 01:54:46 <alyawn> How about a Ubuntu Use-of-the-Month just as a conversation topic 01:55:42 <cyberanger> well, that may work 01:56:14 <cyberanger> ah darn, I only had an hour and a half for the meeting, gotta get back to work 01:56:23 <alyawn> one member gives a short Q&A for something they did or used ubuntu with/for 01:56:26 <cyberanger> finish this project by morning 01:57:00 <alyawn> good luck, cyberanger 01:59:22 <vychune> o/ 01:59:34 <vychune> fedex time i gotta go 01:59:48 <vychune> good talk guys 01:59:52 <alyawn> cya <vychune> 01:59:59 <vychune> o/ 02:19:01 <cyberanger> #endmeetimg 02:19:07 <alyawn> heh... yeah 02:19:23 <cyberanger> [endmeeting]