== Meeting information == * #ubuntu-meeting: DMB 2016-03-28, 28 Mar at 20:10 — 21:26 UTC * Full logs at [[http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2016/ubuntu-meeting.2016-03-28-20.10.log.html]] == Meeting summary == === Review of previous action items === The discussion about "Review of previous action items" started at 20:11. === Ubuntu Contributing Developer applications === The discussion about "Ubuntu Contributing Developer applications" started at 20:13. === Ubuntu Core Developer applications === The discussion about "Ubuntu Core Developer applications" started at 20:13. * '''Michael Hudson-Doyle's application (mwhudson) for core-dev''' (20:14) * ''LINK:'' https://wiki.ubuntu.com/XenialXerus/ReleaseSchedule * ''LINK:'' http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/transitions/ * ''LINK:'' http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/phased-updates.html * ''LINK:'' https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/xenial/+queue * ''Vote:'' mwhudson to be granted core-dev (Carried) === AOB === The discussion about "AOB" started at 21:24. == Vote results == * [[http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2016/ubuntu-meeting.2016-03-28-20.10.log.html#154 mwhudson to be granted core-dev]] * Motion carried (For/Against/Abstained 4/0/0) * Voters stgraber, micahg, bdmurray, cyphermox == Done items == * (none) == People present (lines said) == * mwhudson (71) * stgraber (48) * cyphermox (32) * meetingology (13) * micahg (11) * bdmurray (5) * doko (2) == Full Log == 20:10 #startmeeting DMB 2016-03-28 20:10 Meeting started Mon Mar 28 20:10:15 2016 UTC. The chair is cyphermox. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology. 20:10 20:10 Available commands: action commands idea info link nick 20:11 #topic Review of previous action items 20:11 any change? 20:12 #voters cyphermox stgraber bdmurray micahg 20:12 Current voters: bdmurray cyphermox micahg stgraber 20:12 moving on... 20:13 #topic Ubuntu Contributing Developer applications 20:13 looks like we don't have slashd around here today; skipping to the next point on agenda 20:13 #topic Ubuntu Core Developer applications 20:14 #subtopic Michael Hudson-Doyle's application (mwhudson) for core-dev 20:14 * mwhudson o/ 20:14 mwhudson: please introduce yourself 20:14 hi, i'm a long time canonical employee who has been moving more and into ubuntu dev over the years 20:15 i've been de facto maintaining go for the last 6 or 7 months 20:16 i'm going to be working on using go shared libraries in the next cycle, which will require touching every package that we want to build into a shared library 20:16 which is why i'm applying for core dev rather than ppu, even though i don't have heaps of uploads on varied things yet 20:17 .. is that enough? :) 20:17 oh yes, i've also applied to maintain go in debian 20:18 and have developed a decent relationship with the existing golang maintainers 20:22 any DMB members have questions for mwhudson? 20:22 stgraber: bdmurray: micahg: ? 20:23 mwhudson: how does working on golang qualify you for dealing with all packages in the ubuntu archive? 20:23 cyphermox: well, it doesn't, i guess 20:23 mwhudson: You seem to be in favor of having all uploads reviewed, would you be looking for people to review your uploads? 20:23 cyphermox: surely not all core devs work on all packages? 20:24 mwhudson: well, really it's a thinly veiled deeper question ;) 20:24 cyphermox: i think my record in other projects should indicate that you don't need to worry about going crazy and doing things un-supervised 20:24 bdmurray: for less trivial things, yes 20:24 cyphermox, ohh, he's touching gccgo as well ;p 20:25 doko: you didn't write a testimonial for mwhudson on his wiki page; are you here to cheer for him? :) 20:25 bdmurray: there's a difference between asking for advice/review and asking for sponsorship 20:25 doko: You've sponsored some packages for him, do you have an opinion? 20:25 bdmurray: in my experience on other projects too 20:26 sorry, otp 20:26 bdmurray: e.g. getting commit rights to go upstream smoothed things, even though getting stuff reviewed there is easier than getting sponsorship in ubuntu ime 20:27 that said, if you want to see more general ubuntu dev from me before granting core dev, i won't be offended! 20:28 stgraber sponsored an upload as well :) 20:28 so did I 20:28 haha, yeah, tiny packaging fix :) 20:28 my attempts at getting advocates on my application were not very successful :/ 20:29 mwhudson: it's not that there's anything wrong with the application per se, every one is different. we're just trying to see if you understand the impact of what you're done so far, and limitations 20:29 you have one testimonial from slangasek already, and doko was here too to vouch for you; that's good 20:30 (I'm not saying more to not influence the decision of the other DMB members. FWIW, I'm ready to vote) 20:30 cyphermox: what do you mean by limitations? 20:31 mwhudson: when it's time to ask for review, etc. 20:31 ah ok 20:31 i think by nature i err on the side of caution there 20:31 possibly excessively so :-) 20:32 mwhudson: are you familiar with the release cycle and which type of uploads are appropriate when? 20:33 micahg: yes, more or less 20:34 as in we are in final freeze now, so all changes to things that are seeded require release team approval, and past beta you need a ffe from a release team for new features 20:35 for better or worse i seem to interact with ~ubuntu-release people quite a lot :-) 20:35 do you know where you can find the milestone dates with all the relevant freezes and links to their respective documentation? 20:36 on the wiki? i always have to google to find the page though :) 20:36 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/XenialXerus/ReleaseSchedule 20:37 the stuff i work on tends not to be very user-facing, so i don't know much about the ui freeze/translation stuff 20:38 yeah, googling is fine :) 20:39 but if you notice, feature freeze actually kicks in about a week before the first beta so things can be stabilized 20:40 ah yes 20:40 micahg: when we are in beta freeze or other similar milestone where we're about to put out images, do you know how to check whether a package you're about to upload is affected (and so know when to refrain from uploading)? 20:40 i am subscribed (and actually read :-p) to ubuntu-devel-announce 20:40 stgraber: assuming that was for me, i use seeded-in-ubuntu 20:41 that was likely an mtcf 20:41 * micahg made an acronym :) 20:41 yeah, I sure hope micahg know about it :) 20:41 micahg: m tab completion fail? 20:41 multi-tasking tab complete failure 20:42 ah 20:42 or should that be mttcf 20:42 mwhudson: so next cycle while the cdimage team is preparing beta-1, are you fine to upload vlc to the archive? 20:45 stgraber: i admit don't entirely understand what seeded-in-ubuntu is telling me here (it's only seeded in the daily images, so maybe it's ok?) so i would certainly ask someone before uploading 20:46 mwhudson: daily and daily-live specifically mean that it's on an image 20:46 though I admit my tricky question kinda failed here because mate is now seeding it :) 20:47 mwhudson: care to take a guess at the same for mythtv? :) 20:48 let me guess this is going to depend if mythbuntu is official in some sense 20:48 haha, not official, but close 20:48 i don't *think* mythbuntu is handled by the cdimage team, but i don't know 20:49 mythbuntu is an official flavour, everything seeded-in-ubuntu tells you is usually right 20:49 however mythbuntu is an LTS-only flavour 20:49 so again, i'd be asking 20:49 so they do no put out images in non-LTS cycles which means that those packages aren't actually frozen 20:50 mwhudson: have you ever done a package merge? do you know where to get the list of pending merges? 20:50 ah so next cycle it would be ok to upload something mythubuntu-only during freeze, but it would not have been this cycle 20:50 stgraber: i have merged golang several times 20:50 mwhudson: correct 20:50 stgraber: merges.ubuntu.com 20:50 wait, that's not the list of pending merges i guess 20:50 mwhudson: cool, are you going to help merging more packages next cycle? 20:50 yes 20:51 it is, the links to the index files can be found in the header 20:51 cool 20:51 mwhudson: how about library transitions? can you tell us what's involved with those? 20:51 i also have a medium term plan to get rid of the delta for the golang packaging entirely ... 20:51 stgraber: as in, new SONAMEs? 20:52 mwhudson: right 20:52 i only know the outlines, that you upload a new lib source package that creates eg libfoo4, then upload (or rebuild) all its deps until nothing reverse-depends on the now nbs libfoo3 package and it can be removed from the archive 20:53 i've only watched from the sidelines though, never really been involved 20:53 (something that will obviously change a bit with go shared libraries) 20:54 do you know of the tool we use to track those? 20:54 no 20:55 i know britney/proposed-migration is involved somewhat, but i don't think you mean that? 20:55 http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/transitions/ 20:55 no, ben ^ lets you track the needed rebuilds 20:56 there may be circular dependencies and other complications which require several round of uploads 20:56 * mwhudson bookmarks 20:57 not a very interesting point in the cycle to be looking at that page i guess :-) 20:58 have you ever done SRUs? 20:58 yes 20:58 mostly for gccgo i think 20:58 (so i didn't do the actual packaging, doko did, but i made patches and filed the bugs and did the verification) 20:58 ok, can you describe the process to me, from upload to the archive to it landing on someone's system? 20:59 the upload goes to proposed, the bug gets tagged verification-needed, then once that's changed to verifcation-done and 7 days have passed and britney is happy, it migrates to -updates 21:00 and as updates is enabled by default, everyone should get it next time they update 21:00 just missed two tiny details :) 21:00 1) the upload is held in the queue for review by the SRU team 21:00 2) not everyone gets updates at the same time, we phase them 21:01 http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/phased-updates.html 21:01 ah yes, 1) was totally opaque to me for the longest time 21:01 do you know where to look at the current queues? 21:01 i presume for more user facing things, some staring at errors.ubuntu.com is involved 21:02 https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/xenial/+queue 21:02 cool 21:02 are you familiar with backports and can you explain how they different from SRUs? 21:03 i am loosely familiar, i know the requirements are less stringent about what can get in there, but i don't actually know what the requirements are 21:03 ok, requirements are typically that they must be changed uploads from the source release they come from (backportpackage does that for you) and that they can't break their reverse dependencies 21:03 the key difference from the user's pov is that you only get them if you ask for them, they don't happen to unsuspecting victims 21:04 cool 21:04 do you know how packages end up being pulled into main and onto installation media and images? 21:05 the latter is to do with seeds and germinate? 21:05 * mwhudson spots the pun, very very late 21:05 :) 21:05 yeah, so does the former 21:05 but main is closed under build-depends as well as depends 21:05 do you know where to find the list of packages which should be promoted or demoted by haven't been yet? 21:06 or at least was, or is right now or something 21:06 (i know this is changing) 21:06 um, i know component-mismatches emails get sent to ubuntu-devel all the time 21:06 what's changing is whether packages in main can build-depend on packages which aren't (or aren't yet) in main 21:07 cool, yeah, that's component-mismatches there is also a more comprehensive online report of it with fancy svg and stuff 21:07 so yeah, a bit of guessing gets me to http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches.html 21:07 yep, that one and its matching one for the proposed pocket 21:07 what's needed for a package currently in universe to be moved to main, outside of a friendly archive admin to actually process the move? 21:08 a MIR and the security team review that involves 21:08 ok 21:08 so we're more than out of time and I think I'm out of questions to ask, anything else the other members may want to ask? 21:08 and a package subscriber 21:08 oh yes 21:09 not me 21:09 i am that package subscriber for at least one package :) 21:09 yeah, that's one of the tick box in the MIR process, I think it may even ask for a team rather than individual subscriber 21:14 #vote mwhudson to be granted core-dev 21:14 Please vote on: mwhudson to be granted core-dev 21:14 Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (for private voting, private message me with 'vote +1/-1/+0 #channelname) 21:14 +1 21:14 +1 received from stgraber 21:14 +1 21:14 +1 received from bdmurray 21:14 +1 21:14 +1 received from cyphermox 21:17 micahg: ? 21:21 =1 21:21 +1 21:21 +1 received from micahg 21:22 mwhudson: congratulations! 21:22 woo thanks everyone 21:23 cyphermox: close the vote and wrap up the meeting? 21:23 yep 21:23 #endvote 21:23 Voting ended on: mwhudson to be granted core-dev 21:23 Votes for:4 Votes against:0 Abstentions:0 21:23 Motion carried 21:23 congrats mwhudson 21:24 we're way over time, I think it's time we wrap up this meeting, indeed 21:24 #topic AOB 21:24 any other things? 21:24 nope, hopefully we'll have a new DMB soon :) 21:26 yeah, we need to finish restaffing. 21:26 alright, that's all folks 21:26 #endmeeting Generated by MeetBot 0.1.5 (http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology)