17:00:15 <Riddell> #startmeeting
17:00:15 <meetingology> Meeting started Wed Nov 21 17:00:15 2012 UTC.  The chair is Riddell. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
17:00:15 <meetingology> 
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17:00:20 <yofel_> o/
17:00:28 <ScottK> \o
17:00:33 <Riddell> hi friends, who here for a Kubuntu meeting?
17:00:44 <BluesKaj> just arrived
17:01:55 <Riddell> harald has put a bunch of items on the agenda but isn't here
17:02:32 <BluesKaj> uhoh , gotta go ... wife just reminded me of our band meeting in less than an hr ...later gents
17:02:33 <Riddell> #topic raring UDS work items
17:03:15 <Riddell> a smallish meeting then
17:03:21 <Riddell> who's all read the work items?
17:03:21 <Riddell> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/topic-raring-flavor-kubuntu
17:04:04 <Riddell> or should I reschedule if it's just me and ScottK from the council?
17:04:13 <JontheEchidna> (I'm here too)
17:04:17 <Riddell> oh yes sorry
17:04:21 <JontheEchidna> ;)
17:04:25 * agateau is here for the meeting as well (but not from council)
17:04:48 <JontheEchidna> Do we have a set quorum for these meetings?
17:04:58 <Riddell> 3 council members on votes
17:05:07 <ScottK> So we're good then.
17:05:10 <ScottK> Let's go.
17:05:15 <Riddell> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-r-kubuntu-deferred
17:05:22 <Riddell> anything anyone doesn't understand there?
17:05:47 <Riddell> last time we had some work items that 6 months later we'd forgotten entirely what they mean
17:06:32 <ScottK> ScottK's unique konsole string isn't an issue for raring.
17:06:37 <ScottK> It's upstream in 4.10.
17:06:40 * ScottK fixes
17:06:40 <JontheEchidna> ^was about to ask about that
17:07:04 <Riddell> we might still have some other patched in strings?
17:07:09 <ScottK> Yes.
17:07:21 <ScottK> We do.  I didn't remove the whole item, just that bit.
17:07:24 <Riddell> groovy
17:07:35 <JontheEchidna> py3kde kcontrol integration is still relevant
17:08:01 * ScottK has no idea about steveriley's item, but as long as he does.
17:08:05 <Riddell> JontheEchidna: yes, that's why it's there
17:08:11 <yofel> isn't the kuser work item and the one below it pretty much the same thing?
17:08:11 <ScottK> JontheEchidna: I think I have a volunteer as well.
17:08:18 <JontheEchidna> nice
17:08:50 <yofel> ScottK: samba in win7 is weird and has more than one group, needs some investigation
17:08:52 <JontheEchidna> at the very least, the kuser vs. userconfig comparison doesn't seem very actionable as a work item
17:09:02 <ScottK> yofel: Thanks.
17:09:25 <ScottK> I'd say delete the comparison one
17:09:36 <ScottK> afiestas is going to do a rewrite, so it's OBE.
17:10:04 <Riddell> Quintasan: ok?
17:10:11 <Riddell> I guess he's not here
17:10:23 <Riddell> ok removed
17:10:26 <ScottK> It'd still be groovy for him to help with design of the rewrite.
17:11:12 <Riddell> that's why it's not allocated just to him :)
17:11:36 <Riddell> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-r-kubuntu-packaging
17:11:45 <Riddell> I'll change KDE SC 4.10 to INPROGRESS
17:12:50 <JontheEchidna> looks like canonical's Qt5 packages are now based on debian's
17:13:01 <Riddell> "Investigate with Cédric Bellegarde about packaging appmenu kded" that's actually part of sc 4.10
17:13:09 <Riddell> JontheEchidna: oh interesting
17:13:56 <ScottK> Possibly related to why fabo's work item on packaging Qt5 flipped to in progress.
17:14:34 <Riddell> ok that all seems uncontrovertial
17:14:36 <Riddell> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-r-kubuntu-development
17:14:50 <JontheEchidna> what's the bit about simon and a proprietary library?
17:15:12 <Riddell> simon uses a proprietary library for something but it's optional
17:15:28 <Riddell> so should be fine to package (as far as we could work out in the session)
17:15:29 <Tm_T> "something"?
17:15:34 <JontheEchidna> is it dsfg-compliant as it stands right now?
17:15:41 <JontheEchidna> *dfsg
17:15:42 <jussi> Im here!
17:15:46 <yofel> hm, isn't the touchpad KCM work item from the deferred list a dup of the synaptics work item from packaging?
17:15:52 <Tm_T> jussi: yes you are!
17:16:03 <Riddell> JontheEchidna: it's not packaged
17:16:13 <Riddell> yofel: yes quite probably
17:16:17 <fabo> ScottK: that's right, zoltan is working with me on them and push on qt5 edgers ppa
17:16:30 <Riddell> fabo: great
17:16:35 <shadeslayer> in order to use the proprietary lib, you also need to sign up on some site
17:16:40 <JontheEchidna> oh, I thought it was packaged for some reason...
17:17:00 <shadeslayer> atleast that's what came up during the session
17:17:31 <fabo> Riddell: the deadline is by the end of the month
17:17:50 <yofel> shadeslayer: mind if I drop your old touchpad kcm work item? we seem to have 2 new ones
17:18:05 <fabo> they should be ready for upload to the official archive
17:18:08 <shadeslayer> sure
17:18:12 <Riddell> yofel: go for it, he can steal it back if he wants to
17:18:25 <yofel> done
17:18:58 <Riddell> I'll be impressed if the ibus item gets done
17:19:38 <yofel> hm, development has a 3rd touchpad kcm work item
17:19:38 <jussi> Thats pretty important though, isnt it?
17:19:45 <shadeslayer> hehe
17:20:19 <Riddell> yofel: everyone wants to get in on the act
17:20:38 <yofel> sure, except one's assigned to ScottK, one to kubuntu-dev and the last to afiestas
17:21:03 <ScottK> Feel free to do anything assigned to me.
17:21:16 <yofel> noted
17:21:46 <Quintasan> uhh
17:21:49 <Riddell> let's have only 1 on packaging
17:21:54 <Riddell> yofel: you editing or shall I?
17:21:59 * Quintasan is totally late
17:22:08 <yofel> Riddell: I'm not editing anything right now
17:22:45 <Quintasan> One item less for me? Sound fine.
17:23:01 <Riddell> ok
17:23:06 <yofel> well, we all know that you're busy with maliit :P
17:23:15 <Riddell> steveriley have bravely volunteered for all the docs
17:23:15 <Riddell> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-r-kubuntu-docs
17:23:36 * Quintasan orders a round of applause for Steve
17:23:58 <Riddell> jussi: you can take the credit on that mailing list item if you want
17:24:14 <jussi> hehe, yeah, i did that...
17:24:29 <jussi> but it was all of like 3 minutes work
17:25:05 <Riddell> nothing too major on images
17:25:05 <Riddell> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-r-kubuntu-images
17:25:10 <Riddell> except we want nexus images
17:25:13 <Tm_T> jussi: work nonetheless
17:25:53 <jussi> Ive still a question, they asked us to put it on our council wiki page, but all I could find was this: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Council which says i shouldnt change it...
17:25:56 <Tm_T> Riddell: I try talk one nexus7 for myself, then there's one real-life testing going on when we get the image rolling
17:26:31 <Quintasan> Nexus images eh?
17:26:38 <jussi> I would do some nexus tessting if one was given, Im more than interested, but my funds are limited at the moment. so if a lend comes up, let me know.
17:26:52 <Quintasan> Riddell: AFAIR ogra_ said it would be possible to spin Kubuntu images as long as we get the seed fixed
17:27:21 <Riddell> jussi: feel free to add in an introduction with the link to that and the launchpad team
17:27:45 <jussi> hrm?
17:27:45 <yofel> Quintasan: we do currently have omap4 dailies for raring do we need anything else?
17:28:11 <Riddell> Quintasan: yep, we hope he will
17:28:26 <Quintasan> yofel: OMAP4 != Tegra 3 AFAIR
17:28:37 <yofel> ah
17:28:38 <Quintasan> but don't quote me on that
17:28:39 <ogra-cb_> kubuntu active nexus7 dailies are planned, but we are currently a) not even having ubuntu ones (should be finished this week) and b) are massively short on buildd time
17:28:51 <Quintasan> since I'm not really knowlegable on that matter
17:29:07 <Quintasan> ogra-cb_: I can imagine that
17:29:24 <ogra-cb_> we onlz have a single live builder for arm, while work is going on to abuse the package builders dynamically for that it wasnt scheduled for early raring
17:29:56 <Riddell> thanks ogra-cb_, we're not wanting to rush it :)
17:30:14 <ogra-cb_> what i coudl offer in the beginning (since all other flavours asked too) would probably be something with a lower frequency than daily
17:30:30 <Quintasan> ogra-cb_: What Riddell said, besides there is still some work to do before we even start thinking about images IMO
17:30:36 <ogra-cb_> so that no flavour has to come short
17:30:45 <Quintasan> like Active 3 packaging and more importantly - fixing the seed
17:30:51 <ogra-cb_> k
17:31:06 <Riddell> which brings us onto https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-r-kubuntu-active
17:31:17 <ogra-cb_> well, ubuntu dailies should be ready from end of the week, then i will have time to help with other flavours
17:31:24 <Riddell> rbelem actually popped up last night and said he wants to get back into it
17:31:40 <ogra-cb_> just give me a shout once you want them
17:31:57 <Quintasan> ogra-cb_: Will do
17:32:14 <ScottK> ogra-cb_: Thanks.
17:32:51 <Riddell> Quintasan: do you know what upstream's consideration of mallit is?
17:32:56 <Riddell> maliit
17:33:29 <Quintasan> You might want to rephrase that since I'm not sure what you actually want to know
17:33:44 <shadeslayer> Aaron said that maliit is what active will use
17:33:44 <Riddell> Quintasan: do plasma-active have any maliit integration?
17:33:49 <Riddell> groovy
17:34:17 <Riddell> so any more comments on the work items?
17:34:32 <shadeslayer> came up when I asked him about plasma keyboards ...
17:35:09 <Riddell> if there's no more comments we can vote
17:35:15 <jussi> Riddell: [kubuntu-dev] create good communications with plasma active upstream: TODO
17:35:22 <jussi> what are we actually doing there?
17:35:29 <Riddell> jussi: requested by afiestas
17:35:34 <jussi> How are we acheiving it?
17:35:58 <Riddell> well if I was packaging active I'd join the channel and talk to developers as I tested it
17:36:04 <Quintasan> I suggested to mikhas that we push maliit into Debian as well but that's another matter and I will have to ask ScottK if he can help with that
17:36:22 <Quintasan> But that has to wait until I'm done with the package itself
17:36:28 <afiestas> jussi: that point came out because it seems that there are soime tricky parts when packaging active
17:36:44 <afiestas> and we had no idea about those tricks,  we should askj :p and not be ashame of asking xd
17:37:16 <Riddell> #vote agree on work items for kubuntu raring
17:37:16 <meetingology> Please vote on: agree on work items for kubuntu raring
17:37:16 <meetingology> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (private votes don't work yet, but when they do it will be by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to me)
17:37:18 <jussi> afiestas: ok, I am just trying to understand what the route to getting to [done] is
17:37:24 <ScottK> +1
17:37:24 <meetingology> +1 received from ScottK
17:37:30 <Riddell> +1
17:37:30 <meetingology> +1 received from Riddell
17:37:32 <jussi> +1
17:37:32 <meetingology> +1 received from jussi
17:37:42 <shadeslayer> +1
17:37:42 <meetingology> +1 received from shadeslayer
17:37:42 <Riddell> JontheEchidna: ?
17:37:46 <afiestas> jussi: simply by not being shy and asking questions when needed should be enough
17:37:51 <JontheEchidna> +1
17:37:51 <meetingology> +1 received from JontheEchidna
17:37:54 <jussi> afiestas: ok, good
17:37:56 <Riddell> #endvote
17:37:56 <meetingology> Voting ended on: agree on work items for kubuntu raring
17:37:56 <meetingology> Votes for:5 Votes against:0 Abstentions:0
17:37:56 <meetingology> Motion carried
17:38:10 <Riddell> yay, I worked out how to use the bot
17:38:25 <JontheEchidna> ^action item GET :P
17:38:26 <Riddell> #topic membership
17:38:28 <shadeslayer> hehe
17:38:36 <Riddell> we have a membership applications
17:38:42 <Riddell> from afiestas
17:38:44 <Quintasan> Woah
17:38:48 <jussi> oh god no... not him!! :P
17:38:52 <Riddell> afiestas: who are you and why do you want to be a kubuntu member?
17:39:08 * Quintasan throws bricks at jussi
17:39:15 <Quintasan> Sssh!
17:39:19 <afiestas> My name is Àlex Fiestas (Alejandro Fiestas Olivares legally, you know spanish long names xD)
17:39:41 <afiestas> I'm a KDE developer, working on different areas such hardware integration, kdelibs, and some other miscelania
17:40:25 <afiestas> because of the state of KDE4 hardware integration I felt forced to empower my communication with distributions af ew years back, basically reviewing how distros were packaging my software and try to make it work best in all of them (specially bluedevilk and networkmanagement)
17:40:25 <Riddell> time to quiz afiestas
17:40:45 <afiestas> from that, I became fond of Kubuntu, felt welcomed here, etc :)
17:41:20 <afiestas> oh, why I want to become a kubuntu member
17:41:22 <jussi> afiestas: what do you feel you do specifically for kubuntu? (as opposed to general kde work)
17:41:45 <afiestas> I have been collaborating with Kubuntu for a few years now, 4/5 uds helping to improve the collaboration and communication between what's know as upstream and downstream
17:42:25 <ScottK> Plus he had dinner with us when UDS was in Barcelona.
17:42:28 <afiestas> I do Kubuntu testing (as I said before, specially checking my software) and try to give as much feedback as possible, and being as annoying as possible
17:42:46 * Quintasan likes the latter part of that statement
17:42:54 <jussi> very important that :P
17:43:17 <Riddell> afiestas: how well do we compare to other distros as a faithful implementation of KDE?
17:44:13 <afiestas> the distribution doing more QA, and the more stable is opensuse imho, they have people getting paid to do that (afaik), we have been able to seen this specialy in Kontact or in networkmanagement in the past (where they had ppl working)
17:44:40 <afiestas> suse though is spoiled by YAST, so they are not offering a KDE experience but their own
17:45:13 <Riddell> yeah QA goes well with community only people but only to a point
17:45:17 <afiestas> Kubuntu in the other side had a dark past full of patches, but nowdays you have the moto of being "As much as KDE as possible" being the only ones shipping with rekonq for example
17:45:33 <Riddell> it's why canonical has been upping the QA on ubuntu
17:45:35 <afiestas> which makes Kubuntu right now one of the "purest" KDE experencie
17:45:39 <jussi> afiestas: is there anything in particular you have mind to achieve in the future with us? Any particular goals?
17:45:51 <afiestas> jussi: yes, quite a few
17:45:56 <buzzmandt> I love rekonq, it's so almost there
17:46:12 <afiestas> I want Kubuntu to become the reference distribution for developers, it MUST be the tool I can recommend to others to start
17:46:43 <afiestas> I want to improve QA, by making developers check their software in Kubuntu, as I did with bluedevil and proven to be helpful
17:47:02 <afiestas> I want to help with a different (not packager, not community but developer) PoV in all processes I'm now critic with
17:47:16 <afiestas> like for example, STAGING, updates, etc
17:48:10 <Riddell> #vote afiestas for kubuntu member
17:48:10 <meetingology> Please vote on: afiestas for kubuntu member
17:48:10 <meetingology> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (private votes don't work yet, but when they do it will be by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to me)
17:48:18 <Riddell> +1
17:48:18 <meetingology> +1 received from Riddell
17:48:22 <ScottK> +1
17:48:22 <meetingology> +1 received from ScottK
17:48:23 <jussi> +1
17:48:23 <meetingology> +1 received from jussi
17:48:24 <buzzmandt> +1
17:48:24 <meetingology> +1 received from buzzmandt
17:48:41 <ScottK> buzzmandt: Only Kubutu Council can vote on this.
17:48:50 <Riddell> JontheEchidna: nudge
17:48:55 <xnox> +1
17:48:55 <meetingology> +1 received from xnox
17:48:55 <JontheEchidna> sorry!
17:48:56 <JontheEchidna> +1
17:48:56 <meetingology> +1 received from JontheEchidna
17:49:02 * xnox trolling =)
17:49:05 <Riddell> #endvote
17:49:05 <meetingology> Voting ended on: afiestas for kubuntu member
17:49:05 <meetingology> Votes for:6 Votes against:0 Abstentions:0
17:49:05 <meetingology> Motion carried
17:49:05 <JontheEchidna> :P
17:49:12 <Riddell> afiestas: welcome in!
17:49:19 * Quintasan throws confetti at afiestas
17:49:20 <jussi> afiestas: welcome!
17:49:20 <Quintasan> Grats
17:49:29 <afiestas> thanks you for trusting me :p
17:49:34 <Tm_T> afiestas: welcome! (:
17:49:36 <ScottK> Riddell: Will you do the send an email thing to the CC and cc Mark.
17:49:37 <agateau> yay!
17:49:44 <Riddell> ScottK: yeah can do
17:49:47 <ScottK> Great.
17:49:50 <Tm_T> ScottK: Riddell: also to news team
17:50:20 <shadeslayer> afiestas: congrats ;)
17:50:20 <Riddell> #topic Kubuntu business cards and nexuses?
17:50:33 <Quintasan> business cards!
17:50:36 <Riddell> I was thinking how to use the kubuntu funds to best help kubuntu
17:50:45 <Riddell> business cards for kubuntu members was 1 idea
17:50:48 * Quintasan always wanted a business card
17:50:52 <yofel> +1
17:50:59 <Riddell> the printers local to me charge £32 for 500
17:51:08 <shadeslayer> well ... needs awesome design
17:51:16 <Riddell> KDE and Canonical both do them
17:51:23 <ScottK> OK.
17:51:24 <shadeslayer> Riddell: I could ask spacetime for a quote as well :)
17:51:31 <Quintasan> but I couldn't find a design plus I have absloutely no idea what's the standard size
17:51:43 <shadeslayer> ( our sticker guy )
17:51:56 <afiestas> from experience, I have needed KDE ones quite a few times buecause I feel really bad giving one of my business card (from my business or the company I work for)
17:51:57 <Riddell> shadeslayer: that would be good
17:52:00 <afiestas> having a community business card rocks
17:52:07 <Tm_T> I'm all for business cards
17:52:10 <Tm_T> afiestas: indeed
17:52:10 <Quintasan> Do we have a design?
17:52:13 <shadeslayer> Riddell: will do once I get back to India
17:52:24 <Tm_T> afiestas: I had to hand out my work cards at UDS, so I didn't hand out many
17:52:30 <yofel> Quintasan: don't think so, and I gave up on my attempt to make one
17:52:50 <ScottK> Riddell: I'd say let's get a design and a price and then see if this makes sense.
17:52:52 <shadeslayer> there was a good design on the wiki once, cannot find it anymore
17:53:09 <Riddell> Quintasan: we don't have any designers at the moment, I'm thinking just a logo + name + gpg key
17:53:24 <Quintasan> Riddell: phone and email optional?
17:53:28 <yofel> a simple design with the current font and logo and otherwise black/white would be enough IMO
17:53:31 <Quintasan> maybe just email
17:53:32 <Riddell> Quintasan: oh yes that too
17:53:40 <Quintasan> gpg keys seems nice too
17:53:55 <yofel> gpg key should be there (short at least if the fingerprint doesn't fit)
17:54:10 <Riddell> gpg fingerprint is a common use case I have for them, it's why I've never got KDE ones
17:54:39 <Riddell> ok I'll ask on the mailing list who wants them, limit it to kubuntu members only, and make a design and get a price
17:55:21 <Riddell> my other thinking was there's a need to have nexuses
17:55:25 <shadeslayer> afaik there's a policy that only members get cards ;)
17:55:34 <yofel> there is
17:55:45 <Riddell> does it make sense to buy some for people who will actively help make good kubuntu images
17:55:46 <yofel> or was at least, haven't checked in years
17:55:49 <Quintasan> Riddell: We should get the design uploaded somewhere so people can print those themselves if they ever run out
17:56:15 <Riddell> ?
17:56:24 <JontheEchidna> I just realized that although I have a bunch of Ubuntu people's gpg keys, I don't have any Kubuntu dudes
17:56:32 <JontheEchidna> we should do a keysigning sometime
17:56:47 <Riddell> that needs you to come to UDS!
17:56:59 <JontheEchidna> yeah, yeah :(
17:57:05 <JontheEchidna> stupid school
17:57:16 <ScottK> Or stop by my house next time on your way to Virginia.
17:57:36 <JontheEchidna> keysigning party at Scott's house!
17:57:44 <JontheEchidna> :P
17:57:54 <Tm_T> Riddell: considering that nexus isn't that expensive, it wouldn't hurt to get a few
17:58:00 <Quintasan> JontheEchidna: You're buying me a plane ticket :P
17:58:29 <Riddell> ahem, topic ^^
17:58:35 <JontheEchidna> soz ^^
17:58:49 <ScottK> Well.
17:58:52 <Quintasan> Sorry. Back on the topic, yeah Nexus would be good reference platform I THINK
17:58:59 <yofel> jussi said that he wouldn't mind a nexus
17:59:00 * Quintasan remembers the problems with TF101
17:59:10 <Quintasan> yofel: I don't think anyone would mind one
17:59:11 <Quintasan> :P
17:59:14 <ScottK> About hardware: I think Nexus7 is the right target, but are people really going to do the work.
17:59:14 <shadeslayer> ^
17:59:16 <yofel> I already have one
17:59:50 <shadeslayer> its a fun project, but I don't think I will have the time to hack on it alot ....
18:00:37 <shadeslayer> already have a TF101, which kind of works ....
18:00:46 <yofel> we should probably discuss that on the ML once we have something that actually installs and runs
18:00:53 <Quintasan> +1 yofel
18:00:57 <shadeslayer> *nod*
18:01:10 * shadeslayer has to leave now
18:01:14 <shadeslayer> cya
18:01:15 <jussi> ScottK: I will commit to doing testing at lease 3 times a week.
18:01:26 * ScottK suggests we get active packaged before spending money on hardware to test it.
18:01:33 <jussi> ScottK: yes
18:01:39 <yofel> ack
18:01:55 <jussi> Also, I would suggest we think about giving them as a lend and circulating them if people don't have time.
18:02:07 <jussi> either you do something with it or you lose it
18:02:18 <Riddell> yeah
18:02:31 <Riddell> ok no immediate enthusiam we'll come back to that later
18:02:33 <Riddell> #endtopic
18:02:36 <Riddell> or something
18:02:42 <Riddell> any other business?
18:02:46 <jussi> If you contribute for a whole cycle, you get to keepm it as areward or something
18:02:55 <JontheEchidna> I don't think we can proceed with any of Harald's items without Harald
18:03:01 <Riddell> yeah
18:03:33 <Quintasan> Riddell: I mean it would be nice to buy them outright but if things don't work out immediately then we will have nexuses lying around for nothing :(
18:03:35 <ScottK> We can declare them invalid.
18:03:43 <Quintasan> ScottK: +9001
18:03:54 * Quintasan giggles
18:04:09 <ScottK> Riddell: I say endmeeting then.
18:04:28 <Riddell> #endmeeting