17:02:21 <czajkowski> #startmeeting
17:02:21 <meetingology> Meeting started Thu Oct  4 17:02:21 2012 UTC.  The chair is czajkowski. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
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17:02:27 <czajkowski> aloha and welcome to the CC meeting
17:02:40 * pleia2 waves
17:02:41 <czajkowski> just waiting on some CC folks to join and we shall continue shortly
17:03:08 <czajkowski> #topic Kubuntu Council Catch up
17:03:31 <czajkowski> so who's here from the CC ?
17:03:41 <beuno> o/
17:03:53 <dholbach> I am, sort of
17:03:56 <pleia2> :)
17:04:01 <dholbach> still busy with the Ubuntu 24h crazyness marathon
17:04:02 <czajkowski> ok then
17:04:20 <czajkowski> so Kubuntu council, thanks for coming along, how are things going with you guys these days ?
17:04:40 <Riddell> well mixed
17:04:55 <Riddell> you'll know that canonical dropped us as a supported flavour earlier this year
17:05:00 * pleia2 nods
17:05:26 <Riddell> the announcement for that was handled really badly by canonical
17:05:59 <pleia2> yeah, it was very confusing for a lot of people
17:06:01 <Riddell> the only communication to the kubuntu community was an e-mail which would be great for any politician, managed to say nothing about what was happening
17:06:13 <JontheEchidna> (I suppose those of us here from KC should also wave)
17:06:36 <Riddell> and they changed the message about support for 12.04 which I had to read about in someone blog comments
17:06:46 <pleia2> :\
17:06:47 <Riddell> so that was pretty disappointing treatment of the community
17:07:08 <beuno> right
17:07:11 <Darkwing> I'm still recieving some wonderful comments based on that.
17:07:17 <czajkowski> nods was this brought up in the last meeting I think ?
17:07:22 <beuno> Riddell, and you feel that hasn't been "fixed">
17:07:29 <czajkowski> this is the 2nd time we've meet wtih kubuntu council.
17:07:42 <beuno> s/>/?
17:07:55 <JontheEchidna> I'm not sure what could be done to "fix" it. It may be "water under the bridge" at this point.
17:08:12 <JontheEchidna> it's hard to re-do a press announcement ;-)
17:08:17 <beuno> indeed
17:08:26 <beuno> so what do things look like moving forward?
17:08:42 <Riddell> now we have a company who wants to sponsor us by providing a the support service canonical dropped
17:08:53 <Riddell> and I get e-mails from people asking for just this
17:09:05 <Riddell> but they've been in discussions with canonical since april and it still hasn't happened
17:09:13 <Riddell> so that feels really frustrating
17:09:38 <Darkwing> From the community standpoint, people are asking if Canonical is stalling because they still "own" kubuntu
17:09:42 <JontheEchidna> when you say "it still hasn't happened", you are referring to discussions between the company wanting to provide support, and canonical?
17:09:46 <Darkwing> That's the reaction I have recieved.
17:09:54 <beuno> yeah, of course
17:10:04 <beuno> nothing moving forward, no communication
17:10:05 <Riddell> if canonical don't want to support kubuntu I get that (they have to make money) but now they're stopping the community from being able to do useful things
17:10:11 <beuno> doesn't benefit anyone
17:10:11 <JontheEchidna> e.g. canonical saying, "yes, you can provide support for kubuntu"?
17:10:28 <Riddell> JontheEchidna: right, it's their agreement is moving forward but at a snails pace
17:10:30 <czajkowski> Riddell: who have you been dealing with in Canonical?
17:10:34 <Riddell> I'm told there's only 1 issue left to go
17:10:40 <czajkowski> I think we the CC can chase up on this if needed.
17:10:45 <beuno> Riddell, JontheEchidna, Darkwing, we'll chase this up
17:10:47 <beuno> right
17:10:48 <beuno> :)
17:10:54 <Riddell> czajkowski: amanda and steve george
17:11:28 <beuno> k, we'll get on the case and let you guys know
17:11:38 <beuno> this seems the worst of all situations
17:11:46 <Darkwing> This conversation started at last UDS. IMO, this is killing our community of support.
17:12:21 <Riddell> actually it started before then, UDS was when we finally got a meeting
17:12:23 <beuno> of course, uncertainty is terrible for businesses
17:12:33 <Darkwing> Not to mention the trust of the community of Ubuntu/Canonical (They are being lumped into one at this point
17:12:36 <Darkwing> )
17:13:07 <czajkowski> Darkwing: I can understand that, it might have been an idea to have pinged the CC in the mean time if there was a delay
17:13:19 <Darkwing> Of course, I've been out of the daily loop the last 3 months.
17:13:20 <czajkowski> we dont have any control over the Canonical communications but could have chased up on things before now
17:13:46 <pleia2> yeah, always feel free to come to us :)
17:13:58 <pleia2> I'm glad we have these catchup meetings though, good to catch stuff like this
17:14:06 <Riddell> there's no deliberate attempt to restrict kubuntu there, but we're so low down on the priority list it just doesn't get done
17:14:13 <Riddell> another issue is getting sysadmin to update the website
17:14:25 <pleia2> yeah, I saw that ticket from August the other day
17:14:29 <Darkwing> :)
17:14:32 <pleia2> have you followed up with them on IRC?
17:14:46 <Riddell> I don't know who to ping any more
17:15:10 <dholbach> the people in #canonical-sysadmin should be able to help
17:15:12 <pleia2> in #canonical-sysadmin they always have a "vanguard" in the topic
17:15:15 <dholbach> on freenode
17:15:17 <czajkowski> Riddell: like all RTs #canonical-sysadmin in freenode
17:15:27 <Riddell> I'd rather just move off canonical's web servers but I know that'll end up in another months long issue of getting it approved
17:15:28 <pleia2> they'll be the active one at the time (best to ask during weekdays)
17:16:06 <Riddell> I guess I'll try that
17:16:17 <czajkowski> Riddell: do you have an RT number ?
17:16:26 <Riddell> https://rt.ubuntu.com//Ticket/Display.html?id=20296
17:16:29 <czajkowski> there is a vanguard on there all days at least and even some weekends
17:16:33 <beuno> Riddell, how about filing an RT to move the domain off of canonical?  it will at least be a food place to document and discuss
17:17:19 <Riddell> beuno: one thing at a time!  I don't want to distract them!
17:17:32 <beuno> heh
17:17:35 <pleia2> :)
17:17:43 <beuno> smart man
17:17:58 <czajkowski> does ayone else from the council have any other comments
17:18:08 <czajkowski> I've just pinged somone in the IS channel to follow up on the RT
17:18:19 <pleia2> the quetzal+kubuntu logo from that beta post is so great
17:18:36 <Riddell> for the coming UDS I don't know what track to put specs into or who will accept the specs for UDS
17:18:47 <Riddell> czajkowski: you mean someone other than me moaning :)
17:19:05 <czajkowski> Riddell: no I just mean someone elses view as well
17:19:07 <czajkowski> if they want
17:19:10 <czajkowski> it's an open meeting
17:19:20 <Darkwing> Just from my observations in the Kubuntu community
17:19:35 <Darkwing> This is still teh biggest issue
17:19:41 * pleia2 nods
17:19:50 <Darkwing> Because our hands are completly tied.
17:19:59 <beuno> yeah, I'm really sorry to hear we're still in this situation
17:20:19 <Darkwing> Canonical severed the buisness situation and then we are not allowed to fix it yet.
17:20:45 <sabdfl> hi folks
17:20:50 <Darkwing> Hey Mark
17:21:00 <czajkowski> 18:19 < deej> czajkowski: I'll give the score a bump on it
17:21:00 <czajkowski> 18:19 < deej> It's not a big deal but it's not a five minute thing either
17:21:03 <czajkowski> 18:19 < czajkowski> deej: can you give me an ETA rougly please :)
17:21:04 <shadeslayer> hi :)
17:21:06 <czajkowski> 18:20 < deej> czajkowski: Is it urgent enough that it should take precedence over release stuff?
17:21:09 <czajkowski> 18:20 < czajkowski> not over release stuff no
17:21:12 <czajkowski> 18:20 < czajkowski> but is high as it's reported a few months ago
17:21:14 <czajkowski> 18:20 < deej> Okay, so I'll score it so it should happen pretty much immediately post-release
17:21:17 <czajkowski> so the RT ticket will be looked into
17:21:20 <czajkowski> and again if there are other RTs that need to be followed up on please jsut ask
17:21:34 <Darkwing> So, August RT is not going to be looked at for another month?
17:21:43 <pleia2> release is in 2 weeks :)
17:21:53 <Riddell> that means we'll have out of date content on the website for the release
17:22:00 <Darkwing> Riddell: +1
17:22:58 <beuno> as for UDS
17:22:59 <czajkowski> well we;re in a better place than we were 10 mins ago
17:23:06 <Riddell> yep, thanks
17:23:16 <beuno> Riddell, wouldn't you follow the same process as x/lubuntu?
17:23:31 <Riddell> beuno: I don't know what that is
17:23:47 <beuno> dholbach, you look like a persona who does know!
17:24:23 <beuno> or maybe jono is around?
17:24:32 <jono> hey
17:24:36 <dholbach> beuno, we're in a hangout on air
17:24:37 <beuno> \o/
17:24:52 <dholbach> beuno, which xubuntu/lubuntu process were you referring to?
17:25:03 <beuno> 17:18 < Riddell> for the coming UDS I don't know what track to put specs into or who will accept the specs for UDS
17:25:04 <jono> what can I help with?
17:25:06 <beuno> dholbach, ^
17:25:09 <Darkwing> jcastro... just ask Jorge :D
17:25:45 <jono> Riddell, just put them on the logical tracks (E.g. Desktop for KDE related topics, Foundations for lower level bits, Community for governance)
17:25:52 <jono> and ask the track leads to ensure they get scheduled
17:25:58 <dholbach> beuno, ah sorry - I must have missed that bit - if you choose Desktop, it might help to have a chat with Jason Warner before and if you choose 'other' I think it was Kate in the past
17:26:52 <jono> there will be no Other track this time
17:26:54 <jono> we removed it
17:26:56 <dholbach> ah ok
17:26:59 <jono> we might need to update the website
17:27:40 <dholbach> I'll make a note
17:28:20 <Riddell> I think I'm out of moans :)
17:29:41 <Riddell> oh I forsee issues if ubuntu gets rid of alpha and beta milestones but that's a technical issue rather than community
17:29:55 <pleia2> yeah
17:30:28 <xnox> Riddell: release management was under "other" track last time... wasn't it?!
17:30:44 <Riddell> xnox: yes, dunno what track that'll be this time
17:30:50 <xnox> Riddell: plus there will be feedback from R session where I think that will come up =)
17:33:23 <Riddell> czajkowski: any other questions?
17:33:52 <czajkowski> Riddell: can you please let the CC know the exact outstanding issue that you are wating to hear back on, either here or via email please so we can follow up on this
17:34:10 <dholbach> how is the actual work on Kubuntu coming on? do you have new contributors helping out?
17:35:30 <Riddell> we seem to have a good number of contributors, not sure we're doing as good at recruitment as we have done
17:35:53 <dholbach> I saw a couple of folks who might be ready for upload rights :)
17:36:09 <dholbach> I'll reach out to them again - maybe they'll need encouragement from others as well :)
17:36:17 <Riddell> yeah that would be good
17:36:34 <dholbach> I'll let you know how it goes :)
17:37:57 <Riddell> czajkowski: ok I'll send an e-mail
17:38:14 <czajkowski> Riddell: thank you
17:39:33 <dholbach> apart from recruitment - do you think the kubuntu community is working out fine generally? just in terms of getting things done?
17:40:38 <Riddell> dholbach: for distro development yes I think so
17:41:21 <dholbach> ok great
17:41:24 <dholbach> that's good to know
17:42:05 * JontheEchidna agrees
17:42:19 * shadeslayer agree as well :)
17:42:48 <shadeslayer> while we could always do with more people, we're managing well
17:43:49 <czajkowski> any other comments folks ?
17:44:16 <beuno> none from me
17:44:36 <dholbach> no, I think I'm all set as well
17:44:53 <JontheEchidna> all set here
17:45:07 <pleia2> thanks for joining us :)
17:45:13 <Riddell> thanks for inviting us
17:45:25 <czajkowski> thanks folks for coming along
17:45:29 <czajkowski> #endmeeting