20:03:38 <gilir> #startmeeting Lubuntu Team Meeting
20:03:38 <meetingology> Meeting started Wed Feb 15 20:03:38 2012 UTC.  The chair is gilir. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
20:03:38 <meetingology> 
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20:03:55 * gilir looks around for people :)
20:04:01 <phillw> o/
20:04:02 * Unit193 
20:04:07 * wxl 
20:04:29 <Unit193> wxl: Monkey.... ;)
20:04:34 <wxl> ;)
20:04:58 <gilir> few people tonight, it should be a quick one this time :)
20:05:14 <gilir> aganda : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/IRC%20Meetings/Agenda
20:05:19 <kanliot> k
20:05:40 <gilir> #topic gilir - Review ACTIONS from the last meeting
20:05:59 <gilir> clipboard "issue" is fixed, in time for feature freeze :)
20:06:12 <phillw> well done :)
20:06:22 <wxl> \o/
20:06:28 <wxl> "yes!"
20:06:41 <gilir> still looking for the oversize of alternate
20:06:58 <wxl> gilir: looking FOR or looking INTO?
20:07:19 <gilir> wxl, into
20:07:22 <phillw> it's very close. with feature freeze, I'm told that ubuntu should not keep adding stuff into them!
20:07:24 <wxl> k
20:07:38 <gilir> sorry, my english is worst when I'm tired :)
20:08:05 <gilir> phillw, same for us, we will focus on bug fixing after FF
20:08:50 <gilir> no more actions from previous meeting, I'll continue with the agenda
20:09:10 <gilir> #topic phillw - Weekly report - Update from QA meeting and team
20:09:47 <wxl> brb need more coffee
20:09:58 <phillw> As with all teams, a mad rush for FF. There are no screaming bugs and we do now seem to have enough people interested in PPC to form https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Testing/PPC
20:10:03 <StephenSmally> Hi guys, sorry i'm late
20:10:43 <phillw> I've queried about adding the ppc emulation onto KVM / qemu - but this needs some more research.
20:10:56 <phillw> that's all from QA
20:11:24 <gilir> thanks phillw , let us know if you have big issues when testing PPC
20:11:42 <gilir> #topic Unit193 - Weekly report - Update from IRC OP's team
20:11:52 <Unit193> 1. There is confusion as to how someone gets unbanned, this was brought up after someone got unbanned. 2. We've swapped ubot2 out for ubottu now, so the bantracker will help keep track of bans, and package info should be working better. 3. I may be m
20:11:57 <Unit193> issing something, so if anyone has a comment?
20:12:59 <MrChrisDruif> There WAS confusion about unbanning, but this was cleared in the mailing-list afaik
20:13:32 <Unit193> Not quite it seems.
20:14:10 <Unit193> Questions? Comments?
20:14:11 <MrChrisDruif> What is still unclear then?
20:14:58 <Unit193> Well, not having official access to bantracker yet will make it harder, but everything else should be about good.
20:15:32 <Unit193> Though, it was ubot5, not ubot2.
20:16:13 <gilir> ok, thanks Unit193 :)
20:16:31 <MrChrisDruif> The Lubuntu ops decide if and when a person gets unbanned, so I'm certain about why there seems to be confusion about bans at all
20:17:10 <Unit193> Well, telling what the issue was with someone, or if they understand what went wrong.
20:18:21 <gilir> I'll go directly to dev team report, if you have comment on comm or support team, we will answer them at the end of the meeting
20:18:25 <MrChrisDruif> But now with ubottu should make this more clear for all the ops?
20:19:05 <Unit193> MrChrisDruif: Yes, once everything is finished with setting up.
20:19:25 <MrChrisDruif> Alright, no further questions ^_^
20:19:43 <gilir> we just need to be nice with the new bot ;)
20:19:58 <Unit193> Aye, no kicking her.
20:20:00 <MrChrisDruif> Ghehe
20:20:17 <MrChrisDruif> Only sweet-talk to her?
20:20:19 <MrChrisDruif> ;-)
20:20:21 <gilir> #topic gilir - Weekly report - Update from Devs teams
20:20:30 <phillw> kicking ubottu would result in death !
20:20:42 <gilir> As you may know, Feature Freeze is very close
20:20:59 <MrChrisDruif> Yes, tomorrow!
20:21:04 <phillw> 24 hours and 40 minutes...
20:21:12 <gilir> after this, no new feature can be added, unless we add some documentation and justification for it
20:21:32 <gilir> and I don't like to write this :)
20:21:54 <gilir> we manage to update some components last week
20:22:18 <gilir> new lxkeymap with autostart support
20:22:24 <gilir> lxsession with clipboard
20:22:30 <MrChrisDruif> o/
20:22:31 <gilir> LSC with ratings
20:22:42 <gilir> lxpanel with a lot of bugfixes
20:23:31 <gilir> so if you are running precise, please test them :)
20:23:50 <gilir> especially, if you had bugs with lxpanel, please test again :)
20:24:08 <gilir> but don't worry, we can still fix bug after FF
20:24:33 <phillw> o/
20:24:50 <gilir> I think it's all, any questions ?
20:24:56 <MrChrisDruif> Yup
20:25:00 <kanliot> question time?
20:25:02 <kanliot> yes
20:25:09 <kanliot> in lubuntu precise, every new window gets maximized.  annoying at first, it gets worse and worse as you try and get work done.
20:25:09 <kanliot> it's a feature that should be removed from lubuntu because we aren't using the unity stuff
20:25:19 <phillw> is there any way that setting up full screen on launch of apps could be integrated, or are we too late for that now?
20:25:55 <gilir> kanliot, we added so people can test it :)
20:26:05 <MrChrisDruif> Not current release, but I just thought about it: 10.04 was supposedly a LTS release? What needs to be done to make a dot-release for it (as I think we haven't had one in all this time)
20:26:17 <leszek> hi
20:26:51 <MrChrisDruif> Aloha leszek
20:26:53 <kanliot> please take the maximized windows out..  it's horrible
20:26:57 <gilir> phillw, I may have a solution to have an option available to swith it on or off, but it may be short in time :(
20:26:57 <phillw> MrChrisDruif: we simply do not have enough people in dev to have LTS's
20:27:18 <phillw> gilir: I appreciate that time is short now!
20:27:53 <gilir> kanliot, you are not the only one who complain about it, we can still turn it off
20:27:54 <leszek> yeah for LTS we need maintainers that want to maintain and also patch pcmanfm, lxpanel and all other packages for 5 years
20:28:04 <leszek> thats a huge work
20:28:15 <MrChrisDruif> phillw; a dot-release is more than packaging I understand?
20:28:50 <gilir> MrChrisDruif, you mean dot-release for 10.04, or for 12.04, or both ?
20:29:05 <phillw> MrChrisDruif: as 10.04 was before adoption, it was never an LTS. We want to support it, as it is the last one with the old chip-set stuff.
20:29:06 <leszek> MrChrisDruif: sometimes you need to write patches or backport them, especially when a software isn't maintained in this version in upstream anymore
20:29:16 <MrChrisDruif> gilir; 10.04
20:29:53 <MrChrisDruif> As we've already decided that 12.04 won't be a LTS
20:29:54 <gilir> MrChrisDruif, considering the horrible work we done to maintain 10.04, I'm not sure it's a good idea
20:30:17 <gilir> MrChrisDruif, also, people can still install 10.04, and upgrade after
20:31:01 <gilir> it's the same result than a dot-release, you just dont have ISO already updated
20:31:32 <MrChrisDruif> So the work is already done, but it isn't "packaged" into a release/iso?
20:31:39 <Unit193> And LX stuff may not get in.
20:31:50 <phillw> gilir: I have a crazy idea, but if on installation of 10.04 as a minimal iso - would people be able to lock the kernel from exceeding their kernel limit but still get a newer lubuntu-desktop?
20:32:00 <gilir> MrChrisDruif, there is no ISO yes
20:33:01 <gilir> phillw, you mean to prevent the drop of the support of some CPU after 10.04 ?
20:33:04 <phillw> afaik, it is the dropping of cpu support as of 10.10 that is the issue.
20:33:12 <gilir> :)
20:33:12 <phillw> gilir: yes.
20:33:13 <leszek> phillw: hmm... an unofficial precise ISO with the 10.04 kernel ?
20:33:41 <gilir> phillw, unfortunatly no, because it's not only the kernel, every packages are affected
20:33:53 <phillw> leszek: a way of them getting the precise stuff, but retain their kernel.
20:34:12 <gilir> it's not the same issue than PAE
20:34:18 <leszek> yeah they could use the old kernel with the newer precise base, that should be possible
20:34:21 <phillw> gilir: okies... I did say it was a crazy idea. :P
20:34:23 <leszek> ah ok
20:34:29 <leszek> I only thought about PAE
20:34:41 <phillw> I was also only thinking about PAE.
20:35:12 <gilir> non-PAE are available on precise, so people can still upgrade from previous release
20:35:40 <leszek> ah nice :)
20:36:21 <phillw> from 10.04? That would be one mass of updates to go 10.04 --> 10.10 --> 11.04 --> 11.10 --> 12.04 !
20:36:29 <gilir> and about maximised by default, we can talk about it next week, and let people discuss on the mailing list about this
20:37:23 <gilir> phillw, I think there is an option for 10.04 to 12.04 directly
20:37:54 <gilir> any other question for devs ?
20:37:58 <phillw> gilir: I think that needs a 10.04.4 - which is relased for ubuntu, kubuntu and server tomorrow.
20:38:34 <gilir> #topic MrChrisDruif - Weekly report - Update from Docs team
20:38:37 <wxl> gilir: is max by default now the plan??
20:38:42 <wxl> (i thought it was a bug)
20:38:57 <wxl> regardless of one's preference, if that's the intention, then that's fine
20:39:06 <gilir> wxl, under discussion, but can be drop later
20:39:22 <wxl> ok well someone intended it, so that's fine :D
20:39:26 <MrChrisDruif> Various "bugs" reported and dealt with, otherwise nothing to report.
20:39:56 <MrChrisDruif> Questions?
20:40:22 <gilir> thanks MrChrisDruif :)
20:40:32 <wxl> MrChrisDruif: the "game plan?"
20:40:54 <wxl> i might have missed it; i've been very busy personally lately
20:41:16 <MrChrisDruif> My personal keeps heavily interrupting any plans/time to work on anything like that.
20:41:53 <wxl> MrChrisDruif: well we can discuss this afterward but i think some direction would be good for the team as a whole. if you have some like quick notes or something i could probably embellish on them and get them up somewhere.
20:41:53 <MrChrisDruif> But if others from the Docs team have a great plan to implement, I'm mainly a POC (Point Of Contact)
20:42:54 <MrChrisDruif> A good team leader doesn't determine the route to go, but makes sure everyone on the team is going the same direction.
20:42:54 <phillw> wxl: MrChrisDruif I do have an update re: duplicated/ triplicated pages. I'll get something into a mail.
20:43:08 <wxl> phillw: thx nuff sed ;)
20:43:43 <MrChrisDruif> This means that if the general consensus is a certain idea, I'll try to keep everyone working on that idea
20:43:56 <MrChrisDruif> wxl; sed? ;-)
20:44:02 <wxl> MrChrisDruif: yeah it's direction that i'm referring to. like i wonder what the major issues are. what's the low hanging fruit, etc.?
20:44:20 <wxl> MrChrisDruif: s/sed/said/ ;)
20:45:43 <gilir> ok, let's continue :)
20:46:02 <gilir> Yorvyk is not here, let's move the item to next week
20:46:14 <MrChrisDruif> Low hanging fruit? Major obstacle is indeed the duplication and information on the wrong area (help on wiki and vice verse)
20:46:24 <gilir> StephenSmally, something to say about LSC, since it's released ? :)
20:47:45 <MrChrisDruif> gilir; shouldn't this be in a new topic?
20:48:33 <gilir> MrChrisDruif, it was a topic last week, now I don't think there is something to say :)
20:49:06 <gilir> let's move to the last item
20:49:23 <gilir> #topic wxl - dependencies of lubuntu-core
20:49:27 <StephenSmally> Not much to say
20:49:34 <wxl> oh yeah forgot about that one
20:49:40 <gilir> wxl, I finally understand what you mean about this :)
20:49:41 <StephenSmally> It's out :-P
20:50:31 <StephenSmally> (Anyway, no one removed the old item in the agenda about LSC, i wasn't planning to talk about)
20:50:41 <wxl> gilir: i think this may be resolved if i read the mailing list correct in that it sounds like lubuntu-core is growing a bit to be a bit more "functional" and require the average user to be able to install it without having to do anything extra to get some basics going
20:51:07 <gilir> wxl, to clarify, I added a depend on some common packages for desktop meta-package
20:51:14 <wxl> although i think for some people it would be nice to have a totally stripped down version, but this is possible with net install, yes?
20:51:32 <MrChrisDruif> You mentioned it in the mailing-list already gilir
20:52:03 <gilir> wxl, yes, everything is possible with a net install :)
20:52:23 <gilir> MrChrisDruif, arf, sorry, my memory is not so good today :)
20:52:31 <wxl> gilir: right so we're done with this topic. MrChrisDruif/phillw -- have we already fixed the wiki on this subject?
20:53:21 <MrChrisDruif> I think so, but I'll update the minimal install with links to the corresponding packages.ubuntu.com pages
20:53:50 <phillw> wxl: 12.04 is not yet released, along with the three options out of the 5 that we expect people to wish to use.
20:54:13 <phillw> but it is not a major re-write :)
20:54:25 <wxl> phillw: ahh good point. we should put that on the todo list for later
20:54:48 <wxl> or perhaps just populate the wiki with the new info (maybe at the bottom) for those that are already testing
20:54:51 <MrChrisDruif> We do need to decide on which installations we might want to suggest on the minimial install page
20:55:17 <phillw> MrChrisDruif: I'd go for the 3.... full desktop, core and minimal core.
20:55:48 <phillw> doing a desktop with no-recoomends seems so wierd :P
20:55:49 <MrChrisDruif> phillw; yeah, but I'd go for core, minimal-desktop and desktop
20:57:03 <wxl> when in actuality there are 5 real options: core, minimal-core, desktop, minimal-desktop, and whatever you want with the netinstall
20:57:12 <phillw> MrChrisDruif: but we can discuss the 5 available options,
20:57:26 <wxl> i think we should explain them all because in reality people are giong to ask about them all at some point
20:57:49 <MrChrisDruif> Yup, seems like a mailing-list topic
20:58:04 <wxl> that will allow those people that aren't happy with just the standard install to just pick and choose what works for them
20:58:23 <wxl> of course standard install is desktop, so why talk about it? ;)
20:58:56 <gilir> we are closed to the end of the meeting, anything to add ?
20:59:03 <phillw> on the areas of comms-team.... a discussion is ongoing for a re-vamp of lubuntu.net on the general mailing list. For support team, it seems to be gelling and allowing people from the various support systems chat to each other. nothing else to really report on them both that I am aware of.
20:59:21 <gilir> #topic others topics
20:59:30 <wxl> i will add re: comms that the facebook group is up to 52 members
20:59:32 <wxl> and growing
20:59:44 <wxl> discussions are active, especially with phillw's help ;)
20:59:50 <Unit193> What facebook group? There's quite a few now.
21:00:04 <MrChrisDruif> Lubuntu Official I think he means
21:00:19 <wxl> https://www.facebook.com/groups/lubuntu.official
21:00:23 <wxl> there is only "one" now
21:00:27 <phillw> I'm on them all... makes little difference to me :)
21:01:03 <kanliot> i talked to one of the team member doing the website.  he's doesn't knwo what is required from him
21:01:24 <wxl> unlike the others, this is one that we actually have control over
21:02:15 <phillw> wxl: I though lubuntu was under the control of Mario?
21:02:25 <kanliot> i think the guy is frustrated that he feels that he doesnt have control
21:02:31 <kanliot> i donno
21:02:42 <kanliot> IMHO could be fixed easily
21:02:54 <wxl> phillw: didn't think so-- from what i gathered
21:03:08 <phillw> one for the mailing list :)
21:03:15 <gilir> phillw, it should be
21:03:28 <kanliot> i'll bring it up onthe mailing list thnx
21:04:01 <gilir> ok thanks everyone, it's time :)
21:04:09 <gilir> #endmeeting