16:05:27 <smoser> #startmeeting Ubuntu Server Team Meeting
16:05:27 <meetingology> Meeting started Tue Sep 20 16:05:27 2011 UTC.  The chair is smoser. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/AlanBell/mootbot.
16:05:27 <meetingology> 
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16:05:35 <SpamapS> lol
16:06:01 <smoser> [TOPIC] Review ACTION points from previous meeting
16:06:12 <smoser> no action points.
16:06:23 <smoser> so thats a free pass onto....
16:06:28 <smoser> [TOPIC] Oneiric Development
16:06:54 <Daviey> As you all must know by now we are in Beta2 freeze.
16:07:00 <Daviey> With it shipping this Thursday.
16:07:22 <smoser> Yes, only the great ones are allowed to upload, like zul.
16:07:25 <Daviey> This is a great chance to get testing of the iso in as many ways possible.
16:07:28 <Daviey> Also, we need to consolidate bugs that need fixing
16:07:50 <Daviey> I notice smoser has been busy raising and fixing some nova issues, do you have any news on them landing?
16:08:14 <Daviey> smoser: No, everyone can still upload.. just main fixes need to be b2 crticial.
16:08:16 <smoser> i landed more changes in nova milestone branch in the past 4 days than i'd care to admit to
16:08:40 <Daviey> i noticed.
16:08:40 <Daviey> http://status.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/ubuntu-server/release-bugs.html <- any bugs that need to be decalred there?
16:08:43 <smoser> but, i'm actually pretty excited about nova's state.
16:08:49 * AlanBell goes to fix a bug in the topic handling code to prevent Meeting Meetings
16:09:11 <zul> they should be in the archive today hopefully
16:09:14 <Daviey> smoser: Action AlanBell to that pls :)
16:09:35 <SpamapS> Daviey: I'm pretty convinced that bug 653405 is "fixed" .. but we need somebody to confirm that.
16:09:37 <ubottu> Launchpad bug 653405 in rabbitmq-server (Ubuntu Oneiric) "rabbitmq-server fails to start if hostname is unresolvable or has changed since first starting" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/653405
16:09:41 <Daviey> I could also do with some help with things that need release noting.
16:09:41 <Daviey> So if you have anything, please raise it :)
16:10:07 <Daviey> hmm
16:10:07 <Daviey> someone was looking at that earlier this week
16:10:07 <Daviey> was it lynxman ?
16:10:11 <smoser> Daviey, ...
16:10:19 <smoser> bug 854614 should be on our release list
16:10:20 <ubottu> Launchpad bug 854614 in nova (Ubuntu) "metadata service local-hostname is not fqdn" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854614
16:10:28 <SpamapS> Daviey: also bug 831628 is fixed but sitting in the b2 freeze queue so will land after b2 I think.
16:10:29 <ubottu> Launchpad bug 831628 in squid (Ubuntu) "squid upstart script doesn't check for filesystems" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/831628
16:10:35 <smoser> this is something that JuJu views as being important.
16:11:06 <Daviey> smoser: 854614 i tagged just before this meeting, thanks
16:11:07 <lynxman> Daviey: wasn't me, we just need to confirm that the new version of Erlang and rabbitmq 2.5.0 works as intended
16:11:10 <smoser> yeah.
16:11:29 <SpamapS> Also I think we can stop tracking bug 829063 unless my concerns were addressed
16:11:31 <ubottu> Launchpad bug 829063 in glance (Ubuntu) "should use SSL by default" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/829063
16:12:08 <Daviey> SpamapS: Considering how bad squid has been on upgrades, is this one worth landing for b2?
16:12:11 <Daviey> As in, get it in early?
16:12:46 <macer1> Hello, is this ubuntu server team meeting?
16:12:53 <zul> SpamapS: the glance ssl stuff is still being reviewed upstream
16:12:55 <smoser> macer1, it is.
16:12:57 <smoser> welcome
16:13:11 <SpamapS> Daviey: all the problems on upgrade were caused by the old upstart scripts.. hasn't been a problem since the change to use -N and drop 'expect fork' from what I can tell.
16:13:41 <SpamapS> Daviey: but, if squid is not on the CD.. then yeah why not land it now?
16:13:50 <Daviey> SpamapS: hmm, i thought we had to double tap an SRU for that fix?
16:14:26 <Daviey> SpamapS: ok, will look the package over after the meeting
16:15:36 <Daviey> Triage, Triage, Triage - not just step 1 :)
16:15:36 <Daviey> smoser: move on?
16:15:38 <smoser> yep
16:15:41 <smoser> the other thing is ...
16:15:53 <smoser> we are testing ISOs very soon.
16:16:02 <smoser> Daviey, are you aware of anything that would prevenet testing of $MEDIA ?
16:16:29 <smoser> utlemming would likely be interested as i believe he expects to start testing cloud-images today
16:16:32 <Daviey> smoser: the candidate posted will amost certainly not be final
16:16:43 <smoser> gold
16:16:44 <adam_g> we should probably free up the QA test cluster from our openstack testing?
16:16:49 <Daviey> So testing is still useful, don't hold out.
16:16:59 <smoser> moving on then.
16:17:12 <smoser> [TOPIC] Ubuntu Server Team Events
16:17:18 <Daviey> adam_g: The test cluster could really do with streching it to the limits.
16:18:06 <smoser> The Openstack Developer Summit [http://summit.openstack.org] is in 2 weeks
16:18:17 <Daviey> wow, really only two weeks away
16:18:30 <Daviey> happy days.
16:18:31 <smoser> UDS is actually not far off, especially if you're expecting to get flights and travel accomodations
16:18:32 <zul> hopefully i can make it ;)
16:18:46 * smoser writes a memo to self to get flights
16:18:58 <smoser> anything else to note ?
16:19:07 <adam_g> puppetconf is this week
16:19:09 <Daviey> I'll be at the London release party 13th October
16:19:21 <rbasak> It seems that I'll be there too!
16:19:27 <adam_g> lynxman and i will likely be giving lightning talk on juju + ubuntu server
16:19:28 <Daviey> rbasak: nonoes.
16:19:34 <zul> release party = booze up
16:19:37 <robbiew> adam_g: sweet
16:20:04 <SpamapS> Who all will be at the Openstack Dev summit btw?
16:20:06 * SpamapS raises hand
16:20:14 * adam_g <-
16:20:14 * zul me
16:20:15 * smoser raises hand
16:20:32 * SpamapS raises ttx's hand
16:20:32 <zul> <-- already submitted a proposal
16:20:35 <smoser> also i suspect that ttx and soren to will be there. kirkland also.
16:20:51 <smoser> ok. enough chitchat. moving on.
16:20:52 * kirkland waves a thumbs up
16:20:58 <smoser> [TOPIC] Weekly Updates & Questions for the QA Team (hggdh)
16:21:01 <smoser> hggdh, ^
16:21:12 <Daviey> o/
16:21:55 <SpamapS> I have a question about getting SRU verification help on the occasional important bug..
16:22:41 <SpamapS> mdeslaur was asking if we could finish the squid SRU bug 750371 so he didn't have to supersede it and I didn't know how to get it onto our QA team's radar
16:22:42 <ubottu> Launchpad bug 750371 in squid (Ubuntu Maverick) "squid causing /var to stay busy during shutdown" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/750371
16:23:01 <SpamapS> hggdh: ideas?
16:23:47 <robbiew> :/
16:24:23 <smoser> ok. then.
16:24:48 <smoser> [ACTION] hggdh and SpamapS to discuss SRU verification work for bug 750371 at next meeting or before
16:24:48 * meetingology hggdh and SpamapS to discuss SRU verification work for bug 750371 at next meeting or before
16:24:50 <ubottu> Launchpad bug 750371 in squid (Ubuntu Maverick) "squid causing /var to stay busy during shutdown" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/750371
16:24:56 <smoser> anyone else have anything here ?
16:25:18 <smoser> [TOPIC] Weekly Updates & Questions for the Kernel Team (smb)
16:25:22 <smb> Since there was Plumbers two weeks ago and /me on holiday last week there is not much new. Still not completely happy with Xen HVM and filed bug 854829 just now. Also trying to see whether bug 854050 is somehow reproducable. And if it is whether an updated kernel would help. People seem to have a habbit of using the ami of an release without updating.
16:25:24 <ubottu> Launchpad bug 854829 in xen (Ubuntu) "[Oneiric] Xen HVM: transmit timeouts on emulated 8139cp device" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854829
16:25:25 <ubottu> Launchpad bug 854050 in linux (Ubuntu) "BUG at /build/buildd/linux-2.6.38/mm/swapfile.c:255" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854050
16:25:59 <smoser> smb, yeah, sorry to have dumped that swap bug on you.
16:26:18 <smoser> and the slew of mis-data that is the aws forums
16:26:28 <Daviey> bug 790712
16:26:30 <ubottu> Launchpad bug 790712 in linux (Ubuntu Oneiric) "20110531 i386 server ISO: order 5 allocation failure during install" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/790712
16:26:33 <smb> smoser, no worries, just one of those which seem to happen "sometimes"
16:26:37 <smoser> one happy event on that, though, the original reporter of that hit a hang
16:26:41 <smoser> and called Amazon on support
16:26:46 <Daviey> bug 818177
16:26:47 <ubottu> Launchpad bug 818177 in udev (Ubuntu) "HP DL380G5 root disk mounted read-only on boot and boot fails" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/818177
16:26:48 <smoser> they told him "hardware failure"
16:27:08 <smoser> Daviey, smoser there are udev issues in the ramdisk.
16:27:13 <smoser> this is unfortunately nothing new.
16:27:24 <Daviey> ugh
16:28:04 <smoser> at least my personal feeling is that several of the "rarely does not boot" bugs are a result of udev not behaving correctly.
16:28:07 <Daviey> smb: What server related kernel things do you think are viable to land before kernel freeze?
16:28:27 <Daviey> lol
16:28:51 <SpamapS> smoser: seems to be most often triggered by very high end storage
16:29:00 <Daviey> So yes, what else do you think you can land as of 5 days ago? :)
16:29:08 <smb> Daviey, Not sure that I got anything that is close pending atm
16:29:09 <smoser> smb, i've just been asked for bug 761809. i would like to have that landed for oneiric.
16:29:11 <ubottu> Launchpad bug 761809 in linux (Ubuntu) "Quota modules are missing from the package" [Undecided,Expired] https://launchpad.net/bugs/761809
16:29:33 <smb> smoser, Is that the virtual package?
16:29:39 <smoser> yes.
16:29:51 <adam_g> SpamapS: negative. i hit bug #818177 anytime LVM xists ontop of my low end commodity  stuff
16:29:52 <ubottu> Launchpad bug 818177 in udev (Ubuntu) "HP DL380G5 root disk mounted read-only on boot and boot fails" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/818177
16:29:58 <Daviey> yes
16:30:19 <smb> smoser, apw has been working on having an extra package with all the other stuff. Would that be enough?
16:30:33 <Daviey> smb: ogasawara added the aufs kernel module to the virtual package recently, seems we need a repeat
16:30:50 <smoser> adam_g, SpamapS well some less common ratio of processor:disk-speed:disk-turn-on speed
16:30:59 <Daviey> \o/
16:30:59 <Daviey> we didn't know that
16:31:17 <ogasawara> Daviey, smb: that was prior to the extras virtual package existing
16:31:22 <smoser> smb, well that would in fact be good. but he told me to go jump in a lake once before.
16:31:27 <smoser> when i asked for that.
16:31:33 <smoser> would that land in oneiric ? smb?
16:31:44 <smoser> oh. ogasawara is it *in* oneiric ?
16:31:45 <smb> ogasawara, I think its checkid in now, right?
16:31:53 * smoser gets a clue
16:31:53 <smb> checked-in*
16:32:12 <apw> it is fix committed but not uploaded yes
16:32:18 <ogasawara> smb: yep, committed.  not uploaded.
16:32:32 <smoser> apw, that rocks.
16:33:02 <SpamapS> So sounds like we need to do some intense race hunting in the initrd
16:33:30 <smoser> since i have the kernel team here
16:33:33 <ogasawara> smb: we have a 1 week window between beta-2 and final freeze that I'm going to plan one final kernel upload (pending approval from the release team)
16:33:44 <smoser> do you think that that bug above would be acceptable for a lucid SRU ?
16:33:46 <smb> Sounds a bit with the hint about a combination of lvm and slow disk...
16:33:47 <ogasawara> smb: so if we need to add anything, best to do it now.
16:34:11 <smoser> i'm asked by gondai in ubuntu-server.  ie, could we sru inclusion of -virtual modules for quota
16:34:17 <smb> smoser, Which of the above being Lucid?
16:34:33 <smoser> bug
16:34:35 <smb> ogasawara, I understand if we have the extra package there is things ok
16:34:55 <smoser> bug 761809
16:34:56 <ubottu> Launchpad bug 761809 in linux (Ubuntu) "Quota modules are missing from the package" [Undecided,Expired] https://launchpad.net/bugs/761809
16:34:59 <smoser> is what i was talking about.
16:35:20 <smb> Oh so those are missing in lucid
16:35:50 <smb> Probably there an inclusion of the modules is simpler
16:36:16 <smoser> right.
16:36:22 <smoser> i absolutely agree, but we could get that done ?
16:36:40 <smb> yes
16:36:45 <smoser> apw, you recently marked the task for "investigate missing modules" as DONE
16:36:50 <smoser> did you add/remove anythign ?
16:37:10 <apw> smoser, i don't recognise that WI title ...
16:37:18 <smoser> looking
16:37:27 <smoser> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/other-kernel-o-version-and-flavours
16:37:32 <smoser> [apw] Investigate pulling 'excluded' modules for -virtual into a new binary package/udebs: DONE
16:37:38 <smb> Think that was the one assigned to me and more of a for oneirc thing
16:37:55 <smb> which we stopped when having the extras for that
16:37:59 <apw> smoser, yes that is the one which triggered the -extras pacage
16:38:31 <smoser> so is -extras *everything* such that -virtual + -virtual-extras == -server ?
16:38:51 <apw> smoser, -virtual != -server, but other than that yes
16:38:55 <smb> smoser, There still is a difference in what is compiled in
16:39:11 <smb> (at least)
16:39:15 <smoser> yeah. ok.
16:39:30 <apw> the main difference is things like xeny-ness, otherwise we'd tell you to install -server
16:39:37 <smoser> so i would consider all future bugs of "give me this module in -virtual" much lower priority
16:39:41 <smoser> but still sometimes valid
16:39:58 <smoser> ie, the aufs module and such, should be in -virtual and not require the additional 100MB of stuff
16:40:01 <smoser> anyway
16:40:06 <apw> smoser, you'll have to try even harder to convince us to let them in, we'll likely want to take things out to slim things down
16:40:11 <smoser> i think we've beaten this.
16:40:24 <smoser> apw, right.
16:40:26 <smoser> i like it
16:40:28 <smoser> thank you.
16:40:37 <smoser> that brings us to
16:40:40 <smoser> [TOPIC] Weekly Updates & Questions regarding Ubuntu ARM Server (NCommander)
16:40:43 <smoser> NCommander, around ?
16:41:02 <smoser> i believe that utlemming has made some recent progress around arm
16:41:05 <smoser> and maybe even zul
16:41:09 <smoser> just if you wanted to brag a bit
16:41:12 <Daviey> and rbasak
16:41:16 <zul> smoser: im good
16:41:25 <smoser> i'll brag for utlemming
16:41:33 <smoser> because i think it is seriously cool
16:41:34 <Daviey> NCommander: When you read this, please can you explain why you are unable to attend this slot?
16:41:55 <smoser> you can now download our cloud-images from http://cloud-images.ubuntu.com and they will "just work" under qemu arm
16:42:03 <jamespage> w00t
16:42:12 <smoser> so if you want to just see an arm thing run, you can.
16:42:19 <Ursinha> that's cool
16:42:27 <smoser> yes.
16:42:30 <rbasak> great!
16:42:43 <smoser> ok.
16:42:44 <smoser> moving on
16:42:50 <smoser> [TOPIC] Weekly Updates & Questions from the Ubuntu Community
16:43:01 <Daviey> zul: How is openstack on arm looking?
16:43:17 <zul> Daviey: uh...good
16:43:35 <Daviey> How is our fine community looking?
16:43:43 <Daviey> (Please don't all answer at once)
16:43:56 * zul watches tumbleweeds go one by
16:44:10 <utlemming> smoser: the arm qemu images are actually broken due to a kernel bug
16:44:18 <smoser> boooo
16:44:22 <Daviey> :(
16:44:23 <utlemming> smoser: the fix has been committed, but the latest images don't have the kernel fix
16:44:56 <apw> utlemming, which bug ... so i can add it to the 'why we want to upload' list, and for which branch
16:45:13 <utlemming> sure...give me a minute to look it up
16:45:34 <utlemming> a working qemu image can be fetched from http://people.canonical.com/~ben/images/arm.img.gz for those who want to play with one that is about a week old.
16:46:05 <utlemming> Bug #852225
16:46:07 <ubottu> Launchpad bug 852225 in linux (Ubuntu Oneiric) "ARM kernel writing 32bits to 16 bit register" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/852225
16:46:24 <rbasak> That's a great bug title :)
16:46:36 <smb> Think that one went into master
16:46:56 <Daviey> Oneiric SRU?
16:47:16 <smb> Daviey, Close to release. You have to really argue now
16:47:24 <Daviey> smb: nah
16:47:29 <smoser> "doesn't boot"
16:47:45 <apw> ogasawara, ^^ that lends weight to your upload argument
16:47:58 <ogasawara> apw: indeed.  /me makes a note.
16:48:05 <utlemming> it only affects qemu though
16:48:06 <Daviey> The arm cloud images are not part of the offical release this cycle, unless i am mistaken.
16:48:21 <Daviey> If they get fixed post release as an SRU, seems reasonable
16:48:23 <smb> Daviey, Mainly its a switch to not just dump stuff in but to already switch over to a more stable more with reviewing things
16:48:33 <apw> but they are important
16:48:59 <smoser> well, we will let ogasawara argue that appropriately. it seems we have good representation, and i trust the participants.
16:49:01 <smoser> lets move on
16:49:06 <Daviey> +1
16:49:08 <Daviey> can we go home?
16:49:09 <smoser> i am winning for longest meeting in quite some time.
16:49:22 <smoser> [TOPIC] Open Discussion
16:49:31 <zul> i like turnips
16:49:36 <SpamapS> +1
16:49:48 <Ursinha> lol
16:49:49 <jamespage> I'm a swede man myself
16:50:01 <AlanBell> Daviey: fix committed
16:50:02 <SpamapS> I was reading the launchpad-dev mailing list yesterday, and I saw that they have a very interesting triage process... they do not use Medium as a priority.
16:50:04 <Daviey> Thanks for your input Serge
16:50:24 <Ursinha> SpamapS, yes, that discussion is indeed really interesting
16:50:41 <smoser> SpamapS, a link would be helpful
16:50:42 <SpamapS> Critical means it has to be worked on now. High means it has to be worked on Next. Everything else is Low
16:50:58 <Daviey> We are /close/ to that.
16:51:27 <Daviey> Medium is almost the 'next' High stuff.
16:51:32 <Ursinha> they're discussing possibly using high and medium as they almost don't do that today
16:51:57 <SpamapS> I'd give you a link but the archive seems 2 days behind.
16:52:03 <Ursinha> Daviey, that's how I see it too.
16:52:37 <smoser> moving on then.
16:52:43 <rbasak> I got the impression that Low means probably will never be worked on unless someone has a specific interest, and Medium is the general work queue
16:53:04 <rbasak> (from being new to the process on the server team, not launchpad-dev)
16:53:17 <smoser> i would agree with rbasak .
16:53:22 <smoser> i really dont think its all that important
16:53:25 <Daviey> rbasak: yeah.
16:53:33 <Daviey> Crticial means, panic - all hands on deck.
16:53:44 <SpamapS> Anyway, our Medium queue just for triage is massive.. and I feel like we should look at being honest that we may not ever get to it, so its a Low issue in our *work* priority.
16:54:00 <Daviey> smoser: you don't think the importance is importiant?
16:54:12 <SpamapS> Daviey: he gives it a Low priority is all
16:54:19 <smoser> i would give imprtance a 'low' importance
16:54:26 <Daviey> Anyway, you don't have to use the full hour for the meeting btw.
16:54:35 <smoser> i'm not kidding.
16:54:44 <smoser> we need some way to flag stuff that really matters.
16:54:56 <smoser> currently that is either 'critical' or getting it onto Daviey's list
16:54:57 <rbasak> smoser: as long as importance gets set, so critical stuff is separated out quick
16:54:59 <SpamapS> smoser: High is just that.
16:54:59 <Daviey> end meeting?
16:55:15 <smoser> SpamapS, so what are we discussing ?
16:55:44 <smoser> i work on bugs that are quite reasonably 'Low' before i work on ones that are 'High' at times.
16:55:47 <SpamapS> pushing most things we'd normally say are "Medium" down to Low and possibly reviewing the queue more often to put them in Won't Fix status.
16:56:03 <smoser> the key point above was that if someone thinks it needs fixing and works on it it will get fixed.
16:56:16 <smoser> i'll agree with "wont fix"
16:56:20 <smoser> but daviey wants to go home
16:56:25 <smoser> so i'm not giving any more fuel to the fire
16:56:33 <smoser> [TOPIC] Announce next meeting date and time
16:56:44 <smoser> Tuesday 2011-09-27 at 16:00 UTC
16:57:04 <smoser> SpamapS, Ursinha i do apologize for not giving you as much time as you wanted.
16:57:09 <smoser> but i really do think that everyone wants to go
16:57:11 <Ursinha> that's ok
16:57:30 <smoser> and i think we have another meeting scheduled next week, with another open discussion section next week.
16:57:38 <smoser> #endmeeting