== Meeting information == * #xubuntu-devel: Xubuntu community meeting, 24 Apr at 19:00 — 20:39 UTC * Full logs at [[http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/xubuntu-devel/2014/xubuntu-devel.2014-04-24-19.00.log.html]] == Meeting summary == === Making sure the Processes page is up-to-date === The discussion about "Making sure the Processes page is up-to-date" started at 19:01. * ''LINK:'' https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Processes === Plans for 14.04 SRU's === The discussion about "Plans for 14.04 SRU's" started at 19:06. * ''LINK:'' https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/xubuntu-14-04-point-1 === Cleaning up Launchpad assets === The discussion about "Cleaning up Launchpad assets" started at 19:09. * ''LINK:'' https://bugs.launchpad.net/xubuntu-website/+bug/1305585 * ''ACTION:'' knome to contact LP admins to drop ~xubuntu-xfce-daily-builds and ~xubuntu-buildbot * ''ACTION:'' knome to check if the xubuntu-desktop project has any technical reason to be kept and get it removed if not === Create a testing PPA common to -team === The discussion about "Create a testing PPA common to -team" started at 19:13. * ''LINK:'' https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10844 * ''Vote:'' Team for official testing PPA's: +1 for -dev, -1 for something else (Carried) === Documentation lead change === The discussion about "Documentation lead change" started at 19:29. * ''Vote:'' Appoint slickymaster as the new documentation lead? (-team members can vote) (Carried) * Taking effect immediately, David Pires (slickymaster) is the new Xubuntu documentation lead. * ''ACTION:'' knome to work with appropriate (past) leaders to update the Leaders wikipage today === Using the project money (gathered from Linux Identity articles) === The discussion about "Using the project money (gathered from Linux Identity articles)" started at 19:35. * ''Vote:'' Cover pleia2's printing costs? (-team can vote) (Carried) * ''ACTION:'' pleia2 to follow up with the exact amount with knome, who shall paypal the money to her === Review and discuss team reporting === The discussion about "Review and discuss team reporting" started at 19:46. * ''LINK:'' https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/TeamReports === Use a common area for detailed discussions notes such as Trello === The discussion about "Use a common area for detailed discussions notes such as Trello" started at 19:51. * ''LINK:'' https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Roadmap/Specifications/U/Trello%20Communication * ''ACTION:'' elfy to extend the Trello spec, discussion to follow === Project future: New project lead, council, or something else? === The discussion about "Project future: New project lead, council, or something else?" started at 19:55. * ''LINK:'' https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-team/+members * ''ACTION:'' knome to send a call for new XPL's to the -devel mailing list * ''ACTION:'' knome to send a mail about creating a xubuntu-team mailing list * ''Vote:'' Create xubuntu-team mailing list or not? (non-final voting, just gathering general thoughts) (Carried) * '''Team leaders''' (20:29) * ''ACTION:'' new-xpl: New XPL/council to run a call for a new technical lead === Other issues === The discussion about "Other issues" started at 20:35. === Next meeting === The discussion about "Next meeting" started at 20:36. * Next meeting: May 8, 19 UTC == Vote results == * [[http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/xubuntu-devel/2014/xubuntu-devel.2014-04-24-19.00.log.html#153 Team for official testing PPA's: +1 for -dev, -1 for something else]] * Motion carried (For/Against/Abstained 5/0/3) * Voters knome, jjfrv8-work, ochosi, elfy, slickymaster, Unit193, bluesabre-tmp, GridCube * [[http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/xubuntu-devel/2014/xubuntu-devel.2014-04-24-19.00.log.html#267 Cover pleia2's printing costs? (-team can vote)]] * Motion carried (For/Against/Abstained 7/0/0) * Voters knome, jjfrv8-work, ochosi, elfy, slickymaster, bluesabre-tmp, GridCube * [[http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/xubuntu-devel/2014/xubuntu-devel.2014-04-24-19.00.log.html#221 Appoint slickymaster as the new documentation lead? (-team members can vote)]] * Motion carried (For/Against/Abstained 7/0/1) * Voters knome, jjfrv8-work, ochosi, elfy, slickymaster, Unit193, bluesabre-tmp, GridCube * [[http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/xubuntu-devel/2014/xubuntu-devel.2014-04-24-19.00.log.html#639 Create xubuntu-team mailing list or not? (non-final voting, just gathering general thoughts)]] * Motion carried (For/Against/Abstained 4/0/1) * Voters elfy, knome, bluesabre-tmp, pleia2, slickymaster == Action items, by person == * elfy * elfy to extend the Trello spec, discussion to follow * knome * knome to contact LP admins to drop ~xubuntu-xfce-daily-builds and ~xubuntu-buildbot * knome to check if the xubuntu-desktop project has any technical reason to be kept and get it removed if not * knome to work with appropriate (past) leaders to update the Leaders wikipage today * pleia2 to follow up with the exact amount with knome, who shall paypal the money to her * knome to send a call for new XPL's to the -devel mailing list * knome to send a mail about creating a xubuntu-team mailing list * new-xpl * new-xpl: New XPL/council to run a call for a new technical lead * pleia2 * pleia2 to follow up with the exact amount with knome, who shall paypal the money to her == Done items == * (none) == People present (lines said) == * knome (312) * ochosi (111) * elfy (73) * meetingology (61) * bluesabre-tmp (42) * pleia2 (37) * Unit193 (27) * GridCube (27) * slickymaster (26) * jjfrv8-work (6) * ubottu (2) * amigamagic (2) * Logan_ (1) * new-xpl (0) == Full Log == 19:00 #startmeeting Xubuntu community meeting 19:00 Meeting started Thu Apr 24 19:00:48 2014 UTC. The chair is knome. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology. 19:00 19:00 Available commands: action commands idea info link nick 19:01 i'll skip the action items, updates and announcements... 19:01 #topic Making sure the Processes page is up-to-date 19:01 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Processes 19:02 if everybody could check that page and see if we are lacking some documentation for any tasks we need to take every cycle... 19:02 * ochosi notices that he never actually read that page 19:02 it's a relatively new one 19:03 and still partly WIP by pleia2, Unit193 and myself 19:03 knome, can we have time to read the page and give feedback in the week? 19:03 i think it would be a good idea to have good documentation of everything around if people need to be away 19:03 +1 19:04 GridCube, you can send feedback on the mailing list 19:04 also means you don't have to explain things over and over again 19:04 i just wanted to bring this up now since we have just done everything in the last 6 months 19:04 if you can simply point ppl to a page 19:04 yep 19:04 i mean, can that be an action item for the team? 19:04 GridCube, consider it as an always-open action item for the team 19:05 alright 19:05 if you ever notice the page is missing something, notice people about it 19:05 sorry for being late guys 19:05 pleia2, are you atound? 19:05 sure 19:05 *around 19:05 hey slickymaster, np 19:05 * knome mixes up the agenda 19:06 #topic Plans for 14.04 SRU's 19:06 https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/xubuntu-14-04-point-1 19:07 i guess no news on ibus? 19:07 no 19:07 the lock/suspend issue is being worked on 19:07 but no patch so far 19:07 again, this is one of the items that i just wanted to bring up 19:07 if there's anything you think should be in there, or if you think something should be dropped, be in touch with the team 19:07 currently, i think everything in the blueprint is more or less SRU material 19:08 i guess, honestly i haven't checked all bugreports 19:09 ok, let's keep on discussing about that and fixing the bugs 19:09 and move on 19:09 #topic Cleaning up Launchpad assets 19:09 https://bugs.launchpad.net/xubuntu-website/+bug/1305585 19:09 Launchpad bug 1305585 in Xubuntu Website "Remove unneeded Launchpad assets" [Low,Triaged] 19:09 anybody see a (technical reason) to keep these assets? 19:10 can't see the first two mentioned ever used 19:10 the last one was "used", but doesn't have a technical reason 19:10 and seeing that kind of page might be just more confusing than helpful for users 19:11 yeah, the daily and buildbot ones are related 19:11 yep 19:11 i do think we can get rid of both 19:11 will later bring up my proposal to replace that 19:11 ochosi, ok, good 19:11 #action knome to contact LP admins to drop ~xubuntu-xfce-daily-builds and ~xubuntu-buildbot 19:11 * meetingology knome to contact LP admins to drop ~xubuntu-xfce-daily-builds and ~xubuntu-buildbot 19:11 what about the latter? 19:12 i guess... 19:12 doesnt that recieve bug reports? 19:12 GridCube, no. 19:12 GridCube, maybe load the page yourself and see and stop guessing 19:12 then i dont see why keeping it if its not being used 19:12 i did that 19:13 #action knome to check if the xubuntu-desktop project has any technical reason to be kept and get it removed if not 19:13 * meetingology knome to check if the xubuntu-desktop project has any technical reason to be kept and get it removed if not 19:13 #topic Create a testing PPA common to -team 19:13 ochosi, this is yours ;) 19:14 yeah, so since we had a lot of testing going on in the 14.04 cycle through PPAs (and it worked well for us i think), i thought we could set up a team for that 19:14 so that ppl can push packages that ought to get tested during the dev cycle to a common PPA 19:14 to make testers lives easier 19:14 is there any reason to not link that with ~xubuntu-dev? 19:15 yeah, not all ppl who upload to that ppa might be in that team 19:15 i want to have a rather low hurdle for ppl to contribute to that PPA 19:15 -qa made sense to me. 19:15 wouldn't it make sense to have some kind of moderation for packages that are tested by $all_testers? 19:15 well, we don't want too low 19:15 and if we channel everything through -dev, it won't be fun because that team is too small 19:15 i'd like the -dev team to have more members than now 19:16 yes, i'd want a team that needs approval 19:16 yeah, but -dev can also push to all branches 19:16 that's not the same as up-ing packages to PPAs 19:16 yeah, but with -dev we can verify things before they get pushed 19:16 bluesabre-tmp: i don't mind, but it increases the workload 19:16 yeah 19:16 but with -dev then things would take ages to get on the ppa 19:16 i would vote for -dev, we shouldn't make it too easy to "mess up" with PPA's 19:16 and might get ppl to just push stuff to their private PPAs 19:17 elfy, not really, currently ochosi and bluesabre-tmp are members 19:17 ^ 19:17 mmm 19:17 i'd also suggest at least thinking to add Unit193 and Noskcaj 19:17 +2 19:17 well - most of the things that I ended up testing weren't by any of those that have been named 19:17 bluesabre-tmp: You've been rejected. :( 19:18 ochosi, do you think there would be people who we'd like/trust to push to the PPA, but don't want to give "all branches" permissions? 19:18 so I would STILL end up with a personall PPA 19:18 brainwash made a few 19:18 knome: brainwash has only been around for one cycle, but he put lots of stuff in his PPA for testing 19:18 slickymaster: They could be pretty quickly copied. 19:18 elfy, the point is, those people weren't in that team when we needed them to be 19:18 yeah, we can sponsor ppa uploads as needed 19:18 right 19:19 so we've been bottlenecking on that 19:19 i don't mind another team, if there is justification for it 19:19 ochosi: We'd want to make sure to stress to the packagers to not go willie-nillie with it. 19:19 +1 19:19 i just don't want yet another one just because we have one more task to do 19:19 Unit193: sure, i agree 19:19 if we can delegate that to one of the current teams, great 19:19 bluesabre-tmp, not sure what you're +1'ing ;) 19:19 well as long as it's not just bluesabre-tmp and me reviewing the PPA, i'm fine with -dev 19:19 (Could almost use -team. :P ) 19:19 Unit193, almost, but not really... 19:20 i just wanted to ensure that things are not slowed down because ppl are busy with stuff 19:20 ochosi: which is my worry - at that point do we gain anything 19:20 https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10844 19:20 bugzilla.xfce.org bug 10844 in Window Buttons "Visual feedback for grouped windows in the panel (tasklist windows buttons plugin)" [Enhancement,New] 19:20 how many of the team are around? 19:20 amigamagic: not now please 19:20 amigamagic, can you please take it up after the meeting 19:20 so if Unit193 and Noskcaj get added to -dev and agree to help reviewing and managing that i'm fine with that 19:21 we might just have quorum 19:21 (to vote) 19:21 sorry, I don't know there was a meeting 19:21 team members, raise your hand 19:21 o/ 19:21 o/ 19:21 i don't understand lp mechanics so i dont feel qualified to vote 19:21 o/ 19:21 o/ 19:21 o/ 19:21 o/ 19:21 \o 19:21 one more? 19:22 o/ 19:22 Unit193: always the funny one, eh? ;) 19:22 great 19:22 ochosi: Yep, pretty much. 19:22 hehe 19:22 so, should we vote about this? 19:22 why not 19:22 (-dev vs. new team) 19:22 or do people need more information? 19:22 Ithink so 19:22 let's vote it 19:22 although, for me it depends on how many ppl are in -dv 19:22 -dev i mean 19:22 knome: 2 of the people on -team weren't about for more or less the whole cycle 19:23 and how many want to help with that work 19:23 elfy, yeah, but we have quorum even with them counting ;) 19:23 let's make an assumption: 19:23 Also, just because you technically can push to the branches, doesn't mean you should or will. 19:23 approximately 2 of the people in -dev are always around 19:24 #vote Team for official testing PPA's: +1 for -dev, -1 for something else 19:24 Please vote on: Team for official testing PPA's: +1 for -dev, -1 for something else 19:24 Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (for private voting, private message me with 'vote +1/-1/+0 #channelname) 19:24 (good thing Unit193 does not sleep) 19:24 team members can vote. 19:24 +0 19:24 +0 received from GridCube 19:24 +1 19:24 +1 received from elfy 19:24 if you want, you should be able to private vote. 19:24 +1 19:24 +1 received from slickymaster 19:24 again, i dont feel qualified to say one way or the other 19:24 +1 19:24 +1 received from bluesabre-tmp 19:24 +1 19:24 +1 received from jjfrv8-work 19:24 +1 19:24 +1 received from knome 19:25 +0 19:25 +0 received from Unit193 19:25 +0 19:25 +0 received from ochosi 19:26 do we still miss one? 19:26 no 19:26 #endvote 19:26 Voting ended on: Team for official testing PPA's: +1 for -dev, -1 for something else 19:26 Votes for:5 Votes against:0 Abstentions:3 19:26 Motion carried 19:26 technically we should carry on the motion 19:27 but since it's ochosi's work item... 19:27 anyway, i hope this doesnt end up in lots of review-work that ends up not getting done cause it's annoying 19:27 right 19:27 but let's carry on and hope it goes well :) 19:27 :) 19:28 +1 to that 19:28 #agreed Testing PPA's to be added under ~xubuntu-dev. Reassess if it adds too much workload/creates a bottleneck. 19:28 ochosi: Around after the meeting? 19:28 i'd actually prefer starting with a single ppa 19:28 Unit193: yup 19:28 ochosi, sure sure, single or multiple PPA's 19:28 :) 19:28 e.g. "xubuntu+1" 19:28 that's up for members in -dev to decide ;) 19:29 right 19:29 #topic Documentation lead change 19:29 so, here's were we're standing 19:29 +h 19:29 yes... 19:29 thanks. 19:30 as discussed, jjfrv8-work wanted to step down from the doc lead position. that would take effect now. 19:30 jjfrv8-work, THANKS! 19:30 :( 19:30 jjfrv8-work: thanks for what you have done for us all :) 19:30 :) thanks yes 19:30 thank you all 19:31 but also as discussed, we planned to replace him with slickymaster starting from the U cycle, if he was still up for it and the team agreed 19:31 jjfrv8-work: Indeed, bummer to see you go. 19:31 thanks a lot jjfrv8-work 19:31 jjfrv8-work: very sad to see you go :/ 19:31 yes jjfrv8-work, thanks for a splendid work 19:31 i've asked slickymaster earlier today, and he said he'd still be up for it 19:31 weeee 19:31 let's do a quick vote for that. 19:31 jjfrv8-work: will you still keep contributing? 19:31 absolutely 19:31 I think both knome and slickymaster make sense, considering how much both you did with it. 19:32 good 19:32 #vote Appoint slickymaster as the new documentation lead? (-team members can vote) 19:32 Please vote on: Appoint slickymaster as the new documentation lead? (-team members can vote) 19:32 Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (for private voting, private message me with 'vote +1/-1/+0 #channelname) 19:32 +1 19:32 +1 received from knome 19:32 +1 19:32 +1 received from elfy 19:32 +1 19:32 +1 received from ochosi 19:32 +1 19:32 +1 received from Unit193 19:32 +1 19:32 +1 received from jjfrv8-work 19:32 slickymaster, btw, you are free to vote. 19:32 +0 19:32 +0 received from slickymaster 19:32 :) 19:32 :P 19:32 +1 19:32 +1 received from bluesabre-tmp 19:33 slickymaster: how modest ;) 19:33 GridCube, poke 19:33 +1 19:33 +1 received from GridCube 19:33 #endvote 19:33 Voting ended on: Appoint slickymaster as the new documentation lead? (-team members can vote) 19:33 Votes for:7 Votes against:0 Abstentions:1 19:33 Motion carried 19:33 congrats slickymaster 19:33 ochosi: modest or fearful? 19:33 :> 19:33 fearful :p 19:33 #info Taking effect immediately, David Pires (slickymaster) is the new Xubuntu documentation lead. 19:34 #action knome to work with appropriate (past) leaders to update the Leaders wikipage today 19:34 * meetingology knome to work with appropriate (past) leaders to update the Leaders wikipage today 19:34 pleia2, still not around? 19:35 ok, let's move on 19:35 #topic Using the project money (gathered from Linux Identity articles) 19:35 there was discussing about this, but nothing has actually happened 19:36 i'm proposing the following: 19:36 pleia2 printed some "xp to xubuntu" flyers recently 19:36 let's cover her printing costs 19:36 sure 19:36 +1 19:36 agreed 19:36 +1 19:36 #vote Cover pleia2's printing costs? (-team can vote) 19:36 Please vote on: Cover pleia2's printing costs? (-team can vote) 19:36 Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (for private voting, private message me with 'vote +1/-1/+0 #channelname) 19:36 +1 19:36 +1 received from knome 19:36 +1 19:36 +1 received from elfy 19:36 +1 19:36 +1 received from jjfrv8-work 19:36 +1 19:36 +1 received from ochosi 19:36 +1 19:36 +1 received from GridCube 19:37 (let's do it the official way..) 19:37 +1 19:37 +1 received from slickymaster 19:37 bluesabre-tmp, Unit193 19:37 want to vote? :P 19:37 +1 19:37 +1 received from bluesabre-tmp 19:38 #endvote 19:38 Voting ended on: Cover pleia2's printing costs? (-team can vote) 19:38 Votes for:7 Votes against:0 Abstentions:0 19:38 Motion carried 19:38 Unit193: finally fell asleep 19:38 :D 19:38 Hah. 19:38 and you went and waked him up 19:38 #action pleia2 to follow up with the exact amount with knome, who shall paypal the money to her 19:38 * meetingology pleia2 to follow up with the exact amount with knome, who shall paypal the money to her 19:38 we will still have stuff left 19:39 is there anything else anybody thinks we should use it for? 19:39 o/ 19:39 GridCube, yes? 19:39 my always recurring topic 19:39 He meant pay him. 19:39 heh. 19:39 :) 19:39 we dont have a wallaper of the week thing done yet 19:40 or desktop of the week rather 19:40 GridCube, err, do we need money for that? 19:40 no 19:40 i waht 19:40 XD sorry 19:40 then focus! ;) 19:40 knome: To pay you off? 19:40 hah. 19:40 i missread 19:40 since we've had it for $quite_long, i would propose the following... 19:40 pay elfy for his headset he bought to be able to take part in vUDS 19:40 :) 19:40 Xfce take donations? 19:41 Unit193, i guess, but what's the point, they aren't very active? :| 19:41 really really don't want that - thanks though :) 19:41 ok, then let's not vote 19:41 i was just thinking... :) 19:41 thanks for the thought :) 19:41 i can keep the money on hold still, but i'd rather get it moving sooner or later 19:41 any server costs that xubuntu eats? 19:41 not really 19:41 knome: Still wouldn't be here without them, even though I'd like them to be active I'm thankful that they're still there. 19:41 xfce still can't accept donations i think 19:41 but i can work on that 19:41 bluesabre-tmp, shimmer is hosted on xfce 19:42 bluesabre-tmp, but that's not exactly xubuntu 19:42 and i doubt it adds to their costs.. 19:42 not really, i think xfce is mostly hosted gratuitiosly 19:42 is anybody linked with loco teams that could do something cool xubuntu-related? 19:42 thanks guys 19:42 hi pleia2 19:42 skellat 19:43 sorry, was at an appointment 19:43 pleia2, PM me the amount and your paypal addy and i'll get it done today 19:43 knome: OLF is coming up, yes. 19:43 do we want a big xubuntu banner? 19:43 knome: what about bug bounty? 19:44 is that useful, or do we always go under ubuntu anyway? 19:44 ochosi, for what bug? :) 19:44 the lid suspend bug? 19:44 any bug that is pressing 19:44 or even features 19:44 it has become quite popular recently in foss projects 19:44 and i think it works as a motivation 19:44 and as a reward other than the vocal praise for ppl who actually do stuff 19:44 i'm fine with that 19:45 they can still decide to donate the money back 19:45 or to another bug 19:45 if there isn't anything that needs "covering" now, let's hold the money 19:45 we don't have to spend it all on one bug 19:45 ideas always welcome 19:45 ok 19:46 #topic Review and discuss team reporting 19:46 pleia2! :) 19:46 oh yes 19:46 so I've really just been copying the action items from meetings into our team reports 19:46 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/TeamReports 19:46 March is here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/TeamReports/14/March 19:47 pleia2: thanks, a lot better than having to write them ;) 19:47 indeed! 19:47 yes, that's an improvement 19:47 I think it's going ok :) 19:47 now if #done only worked... 19:47 heh, right 19:49 well, let's use it 19:49 actually not 19:49 anyway, I think we're ok continuing this for the time being, unless anyone else wants to do more work on reports 19:49 but money is sent to pleia2, and $0.40 fee covered by the xubuntu team ;) 19:49 :) 19:49 pleia2: +1 19:49 thanks 19:49 thanks for doing that 19:50 yeah, thanks 19:50 we should probably mention it in the processes page that the one adding the meeting minutes should also update the team updates page. 19:50 and if it's the first meeting of the month, cycle the monthly pages 19:51 #topic Use a common area for detailed discussions notes such as Trello 19:51 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Roadmap/Specifications/U/Trello%20Communication 19:51 elfy, 19:51 I tended to ignore it. :/ 19:51 Unit193, wait, when did you add the meeting minutes? ;) 19:52 I felt it useful 19:52 * GridCube leaves 19:52 if it's valuable to folks, I think trello is lovely to use, but I have my own todo lists so "update trello" tends to land there :) 19:52 ok - so I was just thinking about us communicating a bit better - I spent a lot of time last cycle - going over the same ground - I really don't want to do that again 19:52 besides, that link is bogus 19:52 and elfy and I did use it quite a lot in -qa 19:52 yeah, trello is very good to use 19:52 and it worked for those of -qa that did use it 19:52 elfy, you should harrass everyone with !team 19:52 :D 19:52 elfy, is it about communication about "what do we need to do (generally)" ? 19:53 why? 19:53 elfy, or specific action items people need to take? 19:53 even for managing progress, i'd actually prefer it to the clunky blueprints on launchpad (if it were integrated in launchpad) 19:53 the positive side to LP is the good status page. 19:53 it's more general - there's not anywhere other than blueprints to actually write anything - and that would soon be a nightmare 19:54 ochosi: Nah, if it were on LP, it'd be far slower. 19:54 elfy, want to expand the spec for next week? 19:54 Unit193: hehe, yeah, there we go :p 19:54 elfy, eg. briefly cover what we would use it for, and maybe some action screenshots 19:54 ok 19:54 cheers 19:55 cool 19:55 but if we don't do that - we do need to do something 19:55 #action elfy to extend the Trello spec, discussion to follow 19:55 * meetingology elfy to extend the Trello spec, discussion to follow 19:55 elfy, yep, anything that works for the team :) 19:55 trellolo 19:55 okay, and now the item you have all been waiting for 19:55 #topic Project future: New project lead, council, or something else? 19:55 incecream? 19:56 wb Unit193 ;) 19:56 Unit193: feeling so nervous..? 19:56 too late - we voted Unit193 in :p 19:56 you have just voted the next XPL 19:56 yep 19:56 too bad :| 19:56 joking aside... 19:56 lol 19:56 i think we should organize a call for XPL nominations 19:56 the decison was taken long ago in the backstages 19:57 https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-team/+members 19:57 there's a specific reason why i say this... 19:57 knome: and how long will we wait for that 19:57 i'll do the call at latest on monday 19:57 now that our team is more than 4 people, I think we could actually support a small council if we wanted to go that route 19:57 then some time to gather nominations 19:57 * knome refrains from disclosing the reason 19:57 ...but other people can. 19:58 * elfy thinks we should have called earlier 19:58 elfy, would have been madness to do that during the release 19:58 +1 19:58 it has always gone like this 19:58 elfy: knome is still here ;) 19:58 yea - I know that :) 19:58 so it's his problem if there's no new xpl, he'll just have to stay :D 19:58 time machines ftw 19:58 hah 19:59 well, if no nominations are sent... 19:59 then we will have to investigate other options 19:59 * pleia2 nods 19:59 after loooong consideration and discussions... 19:59 but as pleia2 said... yes, we could sustain a council 20:00 i've started to consider applying for the terrible terrible burden that knome has been carrying for us 20:00 :) 20:00 :D 20:00 Well that could solve that. 20:00 there were a few subsequent discussions with bluesabre 20:00 (who unfortunately left the meeting as it seems) 20:01 so anyway, we can talk about that when he's around again i guess 20:01 yeah 20:01 anyway... i would very much like to see a "single" XPL instead of council 20:01 hey bluesabre-tmp! 20:01 oh, speak of the devil 20:02 I would prefer to see a single one as well if we can 20:02 knome: me too! 20:02 i would also say that we need to lessen the burden 20:02 yes, ok, so now that bluesabre-tmp is around again 20:02 ok, what did I miss? 20:02 if at all possible 20:02 bluesabre-tmp, you're the new XPL 20:02 bluesabre-tmp, just voted on that 20:02 haha 20:02 bluesabre-tmp: i can pastebin you the backlog 20:02 O.o 20:02 or you can check the online-log 20:02 ochosi propsed you and we all agreed 20:03 ochosi: sure, trying to navigate as little as possible since I'm testhering on my phone 20:03 *proposed 20:04 seriously though, knome will do call for nominations by monday 20:04 knome: so how will we lessen the burden? 20:04 pasted to bluesabre-tmp's PM 20:04 so basically, 20:04 well that's one of the things to do imo ^ 20:04 we need to rethink "who" is it who does all the heavy lifting 20:04 to me, it feels natural that the -release team had a bit more responsbility, but also power 20:04 yes, i will. 20:04 release team could take some of the paperwork 20:05 that is, filing exception bugs 20:05 i've been cooperating a lot in -release, and have been happy to see elfy do that as well 20:06 they're not too bad in there ;) 20:06 :) 20:06 maybe there could be team members who would make sure the blueprints are up-to-date 20:06 or whatever method we are using 20:06 can't team leads do their blueprints? 20:06 ideally, all people would manage their own work items 20:06 yeah, I could do a much better job of my blueprints 20:06 sure, that works as well if it... works 20:07 yeah, i think it's hard to formalize that process 20:07 i mean we can say, we create a subset of ppl who handle blueprints 20:07 ochosi, since you have been pondering this, is there something else you are afraid of? 20:07 well I'm happy enough to do qa ones 20:07 i don't think it's a bad idea that everybody *can* 20:07 after thinking more about it, not that much 20:07 there's just stuff that you've been doing that i haven't done often (like chairing meetings) 20:07 if a work item is assigned to [user], user should make sure it's updated 20:07 and you're irc-ier than me 20:08 for chairing meetings, i'd really love to see a rotating chair or something 20:08 yeah... 20:08 would be cool 20:08 * elfy hates driving the bot 20:08 :) 20:08 i guess nobody likes it 20:08 i assume that too 20:08 it drives on the wrong side of the road :p 20:08 I'm usually not able to make it to these mettings 20:09 *meetings 20:09 bluesabre-tmp, then we should reschedule 20:09 I tend to miss the beginning. 20:09 i've no problem with varying meeting times 20:09 we can even let the chair mostly decide the time. 20:09 yeah 20:09 we can have them cycle around a bit 20:09 well take all team leaders, or team members 20:09 to make sure all team members can attend once a month at least 20:09 hm, this sounds like a good idea 20:09 cycle through them evenly 20:10 when it's your turn, schedule how you wish 20:10 and others will, or won't, be available 20:10 mmm not sure about that 20:10 makes chairing more comfortable 20:10 it's not a huge issue that everybody is not being able to make it 20:10 we have the meeting minutes 20:10 and we have the mailing list 20:10 is there any channel where one could do some sort of testdrives knome? 20:10 yeah, and ppl are around anyway 20:10 slickymaster, #meetingology 20:10 ok 20:11 elfy, express your concerns :) 20:11 * elfy test drives the bot in FC meetings sometimes 20:11 hang on - just getting the words right :) 20:12 I'd worry about meetings at that point end up being empty - nothing would get done 20:12 in time 20:12 well, 20:12 it'd be good practice to make sure at least somebody is able to make it ;) 20:12 how about a straw poll with a doodle poll of general times 20:12 we've done that too many times IMO 20:12 any time always seems to be perfect 20:12 then when we start running the meetings at that time, people can't come 20:13 which is one of the reason why i think a "moving target" could work just as well... 20:13 +1 20:13 second thought - a -team mailing list - at least then we'd be able to have targetted discussions 20:13 +1 20:13 elfy, i could +1 that 20:13 I like that idea 20:13 would *only* team members be allowed to send? 20:13 yep 20:14 like a 'council' list 20:14 because if not, soon it would become xubuntu-dev-team-please-include-libreoffice 20:14 huhu 20:14 exactly 20:14 hah 20:14 what do others think? 20:15 pleia2, i know you're opposed to redundant infrastructure, so i want your opinion 20:15 then at that point - we'd have 'votes' on issues that can be taken to meetings whatever time they are 20:15 we can give it a try 20:15 or 20:16 #action knome to send a call for new XPL's to the -devel mailing list 20:16 * meetingology knome to send a call for new XPL's to the -devel mailing list 20:16 elfy, yeah? 20:16 if we do go to something like trello - we could make that private 20:16 well, that's a bit meh 20:16 or maybe not 20:16 trello does do emails notifications 20:16 yea 20:16 bluesabre-tmp, yeah, but is it about all changes? 20:16 i don't want dumb diffs :( 20:17 i want well-written, thought out mails 20:17 it's "hey, you've missed 4 updates!" 20:17 knome: that 20:17 theoretically elfy's idea has potential 20:17 I know because ochosi keep updating a trello that I should be contributing to 20:17 bluesabre-tmp, yeah, that's just email "crap" 20:17 even if it was about meaningful things 20:17 I'd be inclined to m/l rather than trello for team stuff though 20:18 another idea is 20:18 add some moderators and take out the whip at -devel mailing list 20:18 * Unit193 would be a bad choice. 20:18 don't like that idea 20:18 we can make people's mails autoadded to moderation queue by email address 20:18 i think we need to do $something for the -devel list nonetheless 20:19 especially if we create a -team mailing list 20:19 because at that point, -devel could very easily turn into -feature-requests 20:19 i'm still waiting for any input from pleia2 :) 20:20 sorry 20:20 np 20:20 not really - most of the stuff that goes to -devel is general 20:20 ly what it should be - call's etc 20:20 elfy, most of the stuff there now is stuff that could be in -users 20:20 it's not like -devel is overwhelming 20:20 yes, it could perfectley land on xubuntu mailing list 20:20 well, most of the stuff by non-team-members.. 20:20 since release I'd agree 20:21 do we want to design a tag for team communication? 20:21 pleia2, ^ 20:21 pleia2: what we were discussing was a new private m/l for -team 20:21 elfy: yeah 20:21 i know anybody can use that, but... 20:21 might be possible to autosend to moderation queue if it's not from team member emails 20:22 so launchpad makes it very easy for us to create a private list there 20:22 knome: well - I did for a while mail the list with [TEAM] in the subject 20:22 pleia2, launchpad lists are meh. 20:22 holy crap, there is a scorpion in our appartment (no kidding!) 20:22 got a couple of replies 20:22 bbabl 20:22 good lord 20:22 knome: I don't know that we'd need it for a lot anyway :) mostly we just talk here tbh 20:22 pleia2, i'd just make IS create another 20:22 ochosi is not going to make it 20:22 well, related to this 20:23 it was brought up by lionel (mrpouit) that it's getting harder and harder for him to follow/help with development since he's now a lot less in IRC 20:23 Uhh. I'm still stuck at where he said "scorpion"... 20:23 so i think we are being (partly unconsciously) in exclusive 20:23 -in 20:24 pleia2, send meeting minutes there? 20:24 pleia2, run votes there 20:24 sure 20:24 let's do a quick, non-finally-decisive vote 20:25 knome: 20:25 yes hello is this a meeting thing 20:25 to get a general idea what people think 20:25 Logan_, yes, very much 20:25 elfy, 20:25 if we went to -team m/l we could have -release team as the moderators 20:25 hey Logan_ :) 20:25 oh yeah, knome, my -release is about to expire, and it said to message you 20:25 or something - so it's not just another XPL task 20:26 elfy, yes, though we wouldn't need much 20:26 bluesabre-tmp: he knows :) 20:26 bluesabre-tmp, yep, just a sec 20:26 :) 20:26 knome: nope - just when people move in and out of -team 20:26 but yea a quick vote wfm 20:26 #vote Create xubuntu-team mailing list or not? (non-final voting, just gathering general thoughts) 20:26 Please vote on: Create xubuntu-team mailing list or not? (non-final voting, just gathering general thoughts) 20:26 Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (for private voting, private message me with 'vote +1/-1/+0 #channelname) 20:26 +1 20:26 +1 received from knome 20:26 +1 20:26 +1 received from elfy 20:26 +1 20:26 +1 received from bluesabre-tmp 20:27 +1 20:27 +1 received from slickymaster 20:27 +0 20:27 +0 received from pleia2 20:28 bluesabre-tmp, elfy: i've extended you for a month in -release, until we get a new XPL/council/something 20:28 knome: thanks 20:28 bluesabre-tmp, elfy: let's reassess the situation at that point 20:28 ok - ta 20:28 other team members? 20:29 #action knome to send a mail about creating a xubuntu-team mailing list 20:29 * meetingology knome to send a mail about creating a xubuntu-team mailing list 20:29 #endvote 20:29 Voting ended on: Create xubuntu-team mailing list or not? (non-final voting, just gathering general thoughts) 20:29 Votes for:4 Votes against:0 Abstentions:1 20:29 Motion carried 20:29 ok, finally.. 20:29 #subtopic Team leaders 20:30 ochosi, pleia2, elfy: you fine to continue with your leader hats? :) 20:30 yep 20:30 * knome bows to elfy 20:30 sure 20:30 as long as people are ok with it of course 20:30 * knome bows to pleia2 20:30 knome: we should chat re: website at some point though, if you are no xpl, you may want that hat :) 20:30 i don't think we are generally voting about (non-project) team leads 20:30 pleia2, we can 20:30 i don't want anything in 6 months 20:31 but i'm by tentatively open for stuff after that 20:31 I'd be willing to apply for technical lead, not sure if others are currently interested 20:32 mhm, 20:32 i would approve that direction 20:32 having a technical lead that's around would also help with the XPL burden 20:33 * pleia2 nods 20:33 bluesabre-tmp: Get uploader rights. ;) 20:33 i'm all open for other nomiations as well, but i'd say it's a big pro if you are actually around. 20:34 Unit193: yeah, thats the next step 20:34 #action New XPL/council to run a call for a new technical lead 20:34 * meetingology New XPL/council to run a call for a new technical lead 20:34 hmpf. 20:34 #undo 20:34 Removing item from minutes: ACTION 20:34 #action new-xpl: New XPL/council to run a call for a new technical lead 20:34 * meetingology new-xpl: New XPL/council to run a call for a new technical lead 20:35 #nick new-xpl 20:35 #topic Other issues 20:35 anything else? 20:36 yeah, i think we are done and all exhausted :) 20:36 #topic Next meeting 20:36 now't from me for sure 20:36 in 5 minutes 20:36 :> 20:36 hah 20:36 I'm gone next week 20:36 i might be away @may 1 too 20:37 is *monday* a bad day for people? 20:37 that is, may 5 20:37 I'll be away between april 30th and may 5th 20:37 fine for me 20:37 slickymaster, including 5, or not? 20:37 good for e 20:37 I'm gone then too :) 20:37 cinco de mayo 20:37 excluding knome 20:37 mhm 20:37 well what about tuseday may 6? 20:37 workday the 5th 20:37 pleia2, better? :P 20:38 nope 20:38 I'm back on wednesday :D 20:38 hah 20:38 let's do email stuff then 20:38 and have a meeting on thursday 20:39 the regular time 20:39 k 20:39 #info Next meeting: May 8, 19 UTC 20:39 let's hope we have XPL submission mostly in by that 20:39 can not quite be, because need 2 weeks 20:39 (iirc) 20:39 anyway, thanks! 20:39 #endmeeting Generated by MeetBot 0.1.5 (http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology)