15:30 <seb128> #startmeeting
15:30 <meetingology> Meeting started Tue Jun  6 15:30:33 2017 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
15:30 <meetingology> 
15:30 <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
15:30 <seb128> Roll call: andyrock, dgadomski, didrocks, duflu, jbicha, jamesh, jibel/heber, kenvandine, laney, oSoMoN, seb128, tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
15:30 <andyrock> o/
15:30 <didrocks> Laney: confirmed, only flavors do it in scripts/casper-bottom/15autologin now
15:30 <Trevinho> Oh seb.... it's unmeeeting! :_D
15:30 <didrocks> hey
15:30 <Laney> nod
15:31 <andyrock> seb128: can you put me at the end of the list? still trying to record the video
15:31 <andyrock> :D
15:31 <seb128> andyrock, sure
15:31 <seb128> ok, let's get started
15:31 <seb128> #topic dgadomski
15:31 <seb128> dgadomski, hey
15:31 <dgadomski> hey
15:31 <dgadomski> * debugged a printer issue and reported bug #1695884, shared logs with tkamppeter
15:31 <dgadomski> * back to investigating do-release-upgrade conflicting with landscape
15:31 <ubot5> bug 1695884 in cups (Ubuntu) "usb probing malforms Epson TM-T70 label printer output" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1695884
15:31 <dgadomski> eof
15:32 <seb128> thanks dgadomski
15:32 <seb128> #topic didrocks
15:32 <seb128> didrocks, hey
15:32 <didrocks> hey
15:32 <didrocks> * Amazon:
15:32 <didrocks> - UI changed drastically with 0.9, read their new user guide and content.
15:32 <kenvandine> o/
15:32 <didrocks> - Make the incoming snap multi-arch (was amd64 only previously).
15:32 <didrocks> - a lot of back and forth (mostly on our side) with amazon. Still blocked though.
15:32 <didrocks> * Snap: debugged theming issues. Found a new broken use case. Added a trello card to improve/hack around multiple themes potential issues.
15:32 <oSoMoN> o/
15:32 <didrocks> * Removed unity from ubuntu seed (which was readded back and removed again now ;)). Tested on the ISO and found at least another package to temporary remove (ubuntu-session). We'll need to transition it and introduce an unity session.
15:32 <didrocks> .
15:32 <willcooke> back
15:33 <willcooke> EOF didrocks ?
15:33 <didrocks> yeah, that was my traditional "." :)
15:33 <seb128> thanks didrocks
15:33 <willcooke> thx, just wanted to be sure
15:33 <willcooke> shall I drive seb128?
15:34 <seb128> willcooke, what's the # to make you lead with the bot?
15:34 <Laney> chair
15:34 <seb128> #chair willcooke
15:34 <meetingology> Current chairs: seb128 willcooke
15:34 <seb128> Laney, thanks
15:34 <seb128> willcooke, there you go
15:34 <willcooke> #topic duflu
15:34 <willcooke> * PulseAudio:
15:34 <willcooke> - SRU of A2DP Bluetooth audio fixes to xenial:
15:34 <willcooke> . Minor bug updates but the SRU is not progressing (no sponsors yet)
15:34 <willcooke> . BLOCKED?
15:34 <willcooke> * BlueZ: Took over the 5.45 task since Konrad is busy/blocked:
15:34 <willcooke> - Surprisingly bluez git tags are quite different to their release tarballs of the same version. So many branches and trickery are required.
15:34 <willcooke> - Designed a maintenance plan and constructed lots of git branches/tags:  https://git.launchpad.net/~bluetooth/bluez/
15:34 <willcooke> (will document it soon)
15:34 <willcooke> - Prototyped bluez 5.45 packaging for artful
15:34 <willcooke> - Set up a PPA with 5.45: https://launchpad.net/~bluetooth/+archive/ubuntu/bluez
15:34 <willcooke> - Now trialling bluez 5.45 debs on artful. No problems yet.
15:34 <willcooke> * Video acceleration:
15:34 <willcooke> - Working out test cases (acceptance criteria)
15:34 <willcooke> - Reading lots about how the various architectures are meant to work
15:35 <willcooke> - Learning and reading, reading and learning.
15:35 <willcooke> * Daily bug maintenance across gnome-shell, bluez and pulseaudio.
15:35 <willcooke> * Mir:
15:35 <willcooke> - Canceled the 0.28 series and proposed a new changelog and project setup for 0.27.0 (almost entirely work completed many months ago before the reshuffle).
15:35 <willcooke> #topic jbicha
15:35 <jbicha> • Participated in Ubuntu Docs meeting organized by GunnarHJ
15:35 <jbicha> • Started ML discussion with GNOME Docs team about introducing a Docs String Freeze for improved translations.
15:35 <jbicha> • Worked on getting webkit2gtk 2.16 in to Debian stretch (to follow something like how Ubuntu 16.04 LTS has handled updating this package)
15:35 <jbicha> • There's some resistance to both the Docs and webkit2gtk proposals but I'm still hopeful
15:35 <jbicha> • GNOME accessibility packaging in Debian's VCSs, forwarded Unity7 Orca patches to GNOME (don't know if they want them)
15:35 <jbicha> • Completed evolution 3.24 packaging (waiting in artful new queue). The conversion to cmake made this update challenging. LP: #1685683
15:35 <ubot5> Launchpad bug 1685683 in evolution-data-server (Ubuntu) "Update evolution to 3.24.1" [Wishlist,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1685683
15:35 <jbicha> • Began dropping UOA support from evolution-data-server and unity-control-center (LP: #1695928)
15:35 <ubot5> Launchpad bug 1695928 in gnome-control-center-signon (Ubuntu) "Please remove obsolete UOA packages" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1695928
15:35 <jbicha> eof
15:35 <willcooke> thanks jbicha
15:36 <willcooke> #topic jamesh
15:36 <willcooke> I put together a PPA of gnome-builder with the Snapcraft plugin, and
15:36 <willcooke> published some instructions for people to use it on the Snapcraft
15:36 <willcooke> forum.
15:36 <willcooke> I am in the process of putting together a proof of concept prototype
15:36 <willcooke> of xdg-desktop-portal communicating with snaps.
15:36 <willcooke> In the coming week, I will continue with the xdg-desktop-portal work,
15:36 <willcooke> and try to upstream the gnome-builder changes (which will probably
15:36 <willcooke> involve some changes before it is accepted).
15:36 <willcooke> #topic jibel
15:36 <willcooke> heber said he would be out today, are you around jibel?
15:36 <seb128> willcooke, heber just sent an email with a summary to us
15:37 <willcooke> ah
15:37 <seb128> saying he has IRC issues
15:37 * willcooke checks mail
15:37 <willcooke> * Investigated https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/1694531
15:37 <willcooke> * Investigated https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1695212
15:37 <willcooke> * Ubiquity tests are most stable, although with the incoming desktop iso gnome-shell we will need to fix some things.
15:37 <willcooke> * Smoke tests fail for server issues (Timeouts, network connection errors, etc.) Seems that the server is still overloaded. Need to take actions on that.
15:37 <willcooke> * Started work on automated installation of desktop images on HW for testing using MaaS and Testflinger.
15:37 <ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1694531 in main-menu (Ubuntu Artful) "17.10 Install Fails to Start" [Critical,Fix released]
15:37 <ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1695212 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "[Desktop 20170602] gnome-shell fails to start. Black screen on boot." [Critical,Fix released]
15:37 <willcooke> thanks heber
15:37 <willcooke> #topic kenvandine
15:37 <kenvandine> * gnome-3-24 platform snap is now published in the store, edge channel for now.  Once I update some of my app snaps to use it for more testing, I'll publish it in the stable channel.
15:37 <kenvandine> * Shared the poll results and my initial thoughts with the GNOME engagement team.  We'll be getting a call arranged with the GNOME design team and the gnome-shell maintainer to discuss.
15:37 <kenvandine> * Prepared a blog post to publish the results, it'll be published on insights later this week.
15:37 <kenvandine> * The mir folks would like to keep the mir gtk backend enabled for now, so I'm working on re-enabling that.  I'd like to re-enable it and still build without content-hub, working on a patch for that.
15:37 <kenvandine> * Re-added unity to the desktop seed until we can get the gdm3 MIR approved, turns out it still tried to load the gdm schema which is provided by libgdm1.
15:37 <kenvandine> EOF
15:38 <willcooke> thanks kenvandine
15:38 <willcooke> #topic Laney
15:38 <Laney> • Merged debhelper from experimental
15:38 <Laney> ∘ There were a few regressions that I debugged / fixed, and submitted the patches upstream. All got merged now, I think. Turns out it was quite a risky release (experimental, yeesh)
15:38 <Laney> • All that ↑ was so that I could sync fwupd
15:38 <Laney> • ubuntu-dev-tools - finished the bzr → git migration and uploaded to experimental, synced
15:38 <Laney> • asgen/gnome-software:
15:38 <Laney> ∘ Some meson / buildsystem fixes
15:38 <Laney> ∘ Implemented type=codec generation for gstreamer packages so they look nice once we use GS instead of sessioninstaller
15:38 <Laney> ∘ Codec installation to have stopped working in gnome-software since I last tested - need to get to the bottom of that before making a PR for asgen
15:38 <Laney> • Siloed and uploaded fixes to move the Amazon launcher from Unity to GNOME Shell
15:38 <Laney> • Internal stuff (travel planning and work priority discussions)
15:38 <Laney> 🙊
15:38 <willcooke> thanks Laney
15:39 <willcooke> #topic oSoMoN
15:39 <oSoMoN> • upgraded to artful
15:39 <oSoMoN> • updated chromium dev to 60.0.3112.7 then 60.0.3112.10
15:39 <oSoMoN> • updated chromium beta to 59.0.3071.83 then 59.0.3071.86
15:39 <oSoMoN> • chromium 59.0.3071.86 got promoted to stable last night, currently building in PPA and will hand over to ch_risccoulson when ready to publish
15:39 <oSoMoN> • fixed chromecast bug #1621753
15:39 <ubot5> bug 1621753 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "Google Cast no longer finds Chromecast device" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1621753
15:39 <oSoMoN> • working on a script to update copyright file for chromium-browser (not updated since 2012!)
15:39 <oSoMoN> 🔚
15:39 <willcooke> thanks oSoMoN
15:40 <willcooke> BTW, oSoMoN - re: Netflix - I think you should just be able to sign up for a free month's trial, would be easier than me setting it up I think (for me anyway).  If that doesnt work though, I'll get an account sorted for you
15:40 <oSoMoN> ok, I’ll try that
15:40 <willcooke> ta
15:40 <willcooke> #topic seb128
15:40 <seb128> (one day off, monday was a national holiday)
15:40 <seb128> • debugged a bit gnome-shell not starting on the daily iso after the unity->GNOME changes (due to missing gdm schemas)
15:40 <seb128> • tested gnome 3.24 snaps, debugged some issues with Didier and Ken
15:40 <seb128> • reviewed libreoffice update from Olivier
15:40 <seb128> • disabled langpack builds for ubuntu touch
15:40 <seb128> • HR reviews
15:40 <seb128> • some planning discussions and travel org
15:40 <seb128> </week>
15:40 <willcooke> thanks seb128
15:40 <willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
15:42 <willcooke> tkamppeter, ping when you're back and we'll come back to you
15:42 <tkamppeter> - system-config-printer: Several patches to improve on recognition of discovered devices coming from the same physical device, conection type list entries in new-printer wizard, also more debug output. Patches submitted upstream, no answer from maintainer yet.
15:42 <tkamppeter> - CUPS: Mike Sweet rejected filtering network-discovered printers in CUPS. Filtering needs to be done on print dialog level. Concept will be then that the CUPS backend for the print dialog will have option to turn off listing of DNS-SD-discovered printers and then admin can control listing via cups-browsed.
15:42 <tkamppeter> - Google Summer of Code 2017: Worked with the students on a D-Bus interface to connect print dialog backends with the print dialog itself.
15:42 <tkamppeter> - Bugs.
15:42 <willcooke> heh, solved.  thanks tkamppeter
15:42 <willcooke> #topic robert_ancell
15:43 <willcooke> - Made gnome-shell work without libgdm (more work required - https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1695212)
15:43 <willcooke> - Investigation of ODRS (https://odrs.gnome.org/) for use in Ubuntu
15:43 <willcooke> - Trello board tidying
15:43 <willcooke> - Writing Snapcraft.io forum posts about outstanding desktop issues
15:43 <willcooke> - Simple Scan sponsoring
15:43 <ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1695212 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "[Desktop 20170602] gnome-shell fails to start. Black screen on boot." [Critical,Fix released]
15:43 <willcooke> - Short week (Out sick and holiday)
15:43 <willcooke> #topic andyrock
15:43 <willcooke> andyrock, you need more time?
15:43 <andyrock> sooo I failed to record the video
15:43 <willcooke> ack
15:43 <willcooke> #topic AOB
15:43 <willcooke> So, what to do with sessions, usernames, U7 etc
15:43 <Trevinho> Me?
15:43 <Trevinho> willcooke: ?
15:44 <willcooke> whaaa
15:44 <willcooke> how did that happen
15:44 <willcooke> #topic Trevinho
15:44 * Trevinho feels ignored, alone in a bench in Taipei...
15:44 <Trevinho> :-D
15:44 <Trevinho> · Fractional scaling in gnome-shell and mutter work (studying code, small fixes...)
15:44 <Trevinho> · Looking at fixing st-label (gnome shell toolkit) scaling on scaled-framebuffer based mutter
15:44 <Trevinho> · Joined the Fractional Scaling Hackfest (have you heard about it?)
15:44 <Trevinho> · Implemented an algorithm to define the closest allowed scale for each sub-integer value we want (8 per integer at the moment)
15:44 <Trevinho> · Working in supporting fractional scaling in gnome-control-center
15:44 <Trevinho> · Lots of other things related to fractional scaling (like looking at bugs)
15:44 <Trevinho> More at http://go.3v1n0.net/FactorialScalingJournal
15:44 <Trevinho> 😇
15:44 <willcooke> Thanks Trevinho
15:44 <willcooke> so, I had a question...
15:45 <willcooke> If everything is scaled up before being re-scaled for the display its on, is that going to cause lag?
15:45 <willcooke> Seems like n+1 compositing stages?
15:45 <Trevinho> No really...
15:46 <andyrock> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/sMgQi8mK/out-5.ogv
15:46 <Trevinho> The thing is things aren't scaled up until this is not needed... When it's needed it's just a GL transformation in the compositor, so It scales Up and Down again and it will be 1:1 in 4k, while in normal monitors it will be more expensive, but really nothing you see...
15:46 <Trevinho> at least...
15:47 <Trevinho> with an intel driven T440s + a 4k monitor, things are pretty fast anyway
15:47 <willcooke> got it, I think
15:47 <willcooke> thanks!
15:47 <willcooke> Great to read the journal
15:47 <willcooke> exciting stuf
15:47 <willcooke> f
15:47 <willcooke> #topic andyrock
15:47 <Trevinho> andyrock: thanks for including the commentary! :-D
15:48 <andyrock> ahahah removing the audio was too complicated at this point
15:48 <Trevinho> willcooke: it's just few lines, we'll fill better :-)
15:48 <andyrock> so I've working on finishing up the canonical-livepatch panel
15:48 <andyrock> and all the mocks+
15:48 <andyrock> +
15:48 <andyrock> I need to cleanup a little bit as thare are few corner cases still out there
15:49 <andyrock> and I need to run the mock online
15:49 <Laney> nice!
15:49 <andyrock> than I'm done with this part
15:49 <andyrock> eow
15:49 <willcooke> awesome, thanks andyrock
15:49 <andyrock> sorry for the audio and for the xxx directory
15:49 <andyrock> :D
15:49 <willcooke> I'll cut the audio out and re-share
15:50 <andyrock> nothing bad inside
15:50 <andyrock> :D
15:50 <Trevinho> andyrock: the xxx directory is more important I think... :-D
15:50 <jbicha> andyrock: I believe you! :)
15:50 <Laney> C:\windows\system32\systemconfiguration.dll # totally not a secret zip file
15:50 <Trevinho> but at least it *looks* tthat you pay your taxes... ;-D
15:51 <andyrock> too much bulling
15:51 <andyrock> :)
15:51 <willcooke> :) thanks andyrock
15:51 <willcooke> oki, so back to...
15:51 <willcooke> #topic AOB
15:52 <willcooke> Session names, Unity 7, etc etc
15:52 <willcooke> Who wants to kick us off?
15:52 <didrocks> Depending on what we do (but if we ship any extensions/theme change), I would suggest to use 3 sessions:
15:52 * kenvandine agrees
15:52 <didrocks> - ubuntu -> GNOME with our tweaks (theme/extensions) if any
15:52 <didrocks> - gnome -> traditional upstream GNOME, even maybe with default theme
15:52 <didrocks> - we add an unity session for unity7
15:52 <didrocks> (was ex ubuntu)
15:53 <didrocks> thoughts?
15:53 <didrocks> (default installations will only have "ubuntu")
15:53 <jbicha> don't forget about Wayland/X
15:53 <didrocks> why? This is an implementation detail for our users
15:53 <jbicha> GNOME upstream has "GNOME" and "GNOME on X" (Debian stretch & Ubuntu GNOME switched that to "GNOME on Wayland" and "GNOME")
15:53 <kenvandine> i don't think our users should see that
15:54 <didrocks> would make sense for technical users
15:54 <didrocks> less for others
15:54 <kenvandine> users shouldn't care if it's Wayland or X
15:54 <willcooke> If they can't run Wayland for whatever reason, can we invisibily move them on to X?
15:54 <didrocks> or without fallback mechanism
15:54 <didrocks> well, that's what we did with unity3d/2d
15:54 <didrocks> that was 2 sessions, and we fallbacked depending on capability at runtime
15:54 <jbicha> assuming we do Wayland by default, you're not going to give an easy option to revert to non-Wayland?
15:55 <didrocks> well, they won't see the session name
15:55 <didrocks> but they still can switch for more advanced users
15:55 <jbicha> on the login screen, Ubuntu GNOME has 2 separate choices (3 if you count GNOME Classic)
15:55 <seb128> is that something many users are going to want/need? if so why?
15:55 <didrocks> I would think silent fallback is the best
15:56 <kenvandine> +1 if we can
15:56 <jbicha> there's a nasty bug in 17.04 (probably mostly fixed by the libgweather SRU) that crashes GNOME Shell
15:56 <jbicha> if GNOME Shell crashes when you are running Wayland, you lose your session and all your work, but if you are running GNOME on X it should magically restart gnome-shell if it can (it usually can)
15:57 <didrocks> well, sounds like more wayland bugs that needs to be fixed, I don't think anyone wants that in the long term
15:57 <willcooke> Having many options at the login screen is too confusing.  By default we have GNOME (our implementation), if they have also installed U7, that's there, and if we do have some packages for a more vanilla GNOME and they choose to install that, ok.  But by default I think we should just have the one session available from the login screen.
15:57 <didrocks> or everyone would stay on X forever…
15:58 <jbicha> there are a few apps that do not run on our current implementation of GNOME on Wayland (synaptic, gparted, etc.) because they never switched to using policykit
15:58 <didrocks> doesn't prevent to have an option for advanced users somewhere triggering the fallback on boot
15:58 <didrocks> (s/boot/login/)
15:58 <willcooke> jbicha, will those apps run under xwayland?
15:59 <didrocks> but yeah, nothing in the face of our users IMHO
15:59 <jbicha> willcooke: no, I mean there are a couple hacks we could do if we really wanted to but I think we actually do not want to weaken the security improvement
16:00 <willcooke> can we get by without gparted?  Does disks do enough to replace it?
16:01 <jbicha> btw, gparted is currently on the live iso but removed after install (while GNOME Disks stays)
16:02 <willcooke> ah, right
16:02 <jbicha> anyway, that's 2 reasons for why users might want to run X instead
16:03 <jbicha> the only other concern is implementing a single session since upstream split it in two
16:03 <didrocks> we can either split it (but it means 2 sessions on the login screen), or do an option in some settings which triggers the fallback at boot that we'll need either way
16:03 <mdeslaur> I thought I switched synaptic and gparted to pkexec a while ago?
16:05 <jbicha> mdeslaur: I'll investigate and get back with you on that
16:05 <willcooke> jbicha, would you mind checking on that ^ ?
16:06 <willcooke> seb128, Laney, jbicha - So did we reach a conclusion here?
16:07 <Laney> Don't think so
16:07 <seb128> hum
16:07 <seb128> not really no
16:07 <Laney> Seems to hinge on this fallback thing
16:08 <willcooke> Who can investigate that some more?  didrocks, is your knowledge of the 2d/3d stuff useful here?
16:08 <jbicha> GNOME already only offers Wayland if it thinks it's supported
16:09 <jbicha> in gnome-session
16:09 <didrocks> willcooke: for the implementation of the fallback mecanism, yes, but on knowing what to detect for wayland, I'm unsure
16:09 <Laney> it TryExecs it
16:09 <didrocks> ah
16:09 <Laney> I don't know if that then falls back to X though
16:09 <Laney> that's to show in the greeter
16:09 <didrocks> oh right, they do it in gdm
16:09 <didrocks> before
16:09 <Laney> AFAIK!
16:09 <willcooke> so more work in LightDM needed? Hummm
16:10 <jbicha> Laney: I think it does something more complicated than a simple TryExec
16:10 <Laney> ok, where's that then?
16:10 <Laney> I see a TryExec in the .desktop file here
16:10 <didrocks> willcooke: well, we will need a lightDM greeter running on wayland and one on X
16:10 <jbicha> I see a TryExec=gnome-shell which doesn't tell you about wayland
16:10 <didrocks> so basically, lightdm/greeter will need to do that detection
16:11 <Laney> ?
16:11 <Laney> it's in /usr/share/wayland-sessions/
16:12 <Laney> anyway, I never read the code to find out if that is what happens :)
16:13 <willcooke> seb128, Laney - could you get us to a point that we can talk more on Thursday, and try and get this resolved one way or the other by Friday EOD?
16:13 <jbicha> I think part of it is that GDM runs with Wayland by default
16:13 <jbicha> but if GDM is running as X then it does not provide a Wayland option
16:14 <didrocks> seb128: Laney: don't forget my point about the lightdm greeter in both flavors is needed (wayland and X), so I guess doing the right session presentation is needed at an earlier stage that we had
16:14 <seb128> didrocks, do we need them at the same time?
16:14 <seb128> or just fallback to start a X one if wayland fails?
16:15 <didrocks> seb128: "same time", being?
16:15 <seb128> willcooke, should be doable, we can continue that discussion after meeting/tomorrow
16:15 <willcooke> thanks
16:15 <willcooke> ok, anyone got more AOB before we close the meeting?
16:15 <seb128> didrocks, "in both flavors" you mean having option to use it with wayland or X or having one of each on different VTs?
16:16 <jbicha> the other question was if unity7 would be autoremovable for upgraders
16:16 <seb128> willcooke, I have one that can wait next week (rediscuss i386 iso status)
16:16 <didrocks> seb128: no, I mean, lightdm needs to be smart to start an X version of the greeter if the wayland one doesn't work
16:16 <seb128> didrocks, right, agreed
16:16 <didrocks> (and so, we need a wayland based greeter and an X one)
16:17 <seb128> are those different greeters? or just lightdm being smart enough to know what server to use and the same greeter code?
16:17 <seb128> anyway to discuss with Robert I guess
16:17 <willcooke> oki, lets speak about auto remove U7 then
16:17 <didrocks> don't know, yeah, Robert should know more
16:17 <seb128> thanks for poiting it out didrocks
16:17 <didrocks> yw!
16:17 <seb128> I'm going to email Robert and Cc you/L_aney/j_bicha
16:17 <seb128> and Will
16:17 <willcooke> thanks seb128
16:18 <didrocks> thx
16:19 <willcooke> Auto remove U7 - very tricky.  I don't really have a strong feeling.  It's not that we're offering up GNOME Shell as a preview here, it is the new desktop.  So removing it seeeeems to be ok.
16:19 <didrocks> we didn't remove gnome classic when switching to unity
16:19 <willcooke> But it will be surprising to a few people, no doubt
16:19 <seb128> I'm a bit balanced on that as well
16:19 <didrocks> I don't think it's a  policy to remove things for people who upgrade (but we change default session with our new things)
16:19 <seb128> maybe to revist once we have some feedback about what users think of the new desktop
16:19 <didrocks> I would suggest we keep unity, just move it to this new session for people who want to reswitch
16:19 <seb128> but yeah what didrocks says
16:19 <jbicha> LP: #1686081 is a nasty bug if a user has Unity7 installed
16:19 <ubot5> Launchpad bug 1686081 in xorg (Ubuntu) "If -synaptics is installed, GNOME Mouse & Touchpad Settings doesn't work" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1686081
16:20 <kenvandine> don't want to shock the users
16:20 <jbicha> currently, there are zero people maintaining unity7
16:20 <seb128> jbicha keeps nagging about that one
16:20 <jbicha> unity7 FTBFS right now and I'd like if someone could help me on it :)
16:20 <jbicha> (test failures)
16:21 <seb128> Trevinho, andyrock, ^ can you have a look?
16:21 <seb128> jbicha, do you have a bug open about that?
16:21 <seb128> would be useful to assign etc
16:21 <jbicha> I'll probably open a bug, but currently it was briefly discussed at https://code.launchpad.net/~jbicha/unity/drop-uoa-recommends/+merge/325097
16:21 <andyrock> it's eod for me
16:21 <seb128> please open a bug and give me the ref
16:21 <andyrock> I can take a look tomorrow
16:22 <seb128> I see with andyrock tomorrow
16:22 <seb128> andyrock, yeah tomorrow is fine, thanks
16:23 <jbicha> I would be happier with Unity7 if it could be ported to use unity-settings-daemon, unity-control-center but that needs more work to reimplement stuff that GNOME upstream dropped
16:23 <seb128> you mean gnome-settings-daemon?
16:23 <jbicha> oops, yes
16:24 <seb128> well the oem team would like to backport libinput support for xenial ideally
16:24 <seb128> so maybe that specific synaptic issue is resolved by that work
16:24 <seb128> well "backport", rather add and backport
16:24 <jbicha> yes, that would fix that
16:25 <seb128> on removing let's maybe revisit in another meeting or discuss on the list?
16:25 <willcooke> +1
16:25 <seb128> we quite overrun already
16:25 <willcooke> let's get the blockers looked at in the meantime too
16:25 <seb128> yeah
16:25 <jbicha> some GNOME apps really want GNOME Online Accounts to be available but that's messy with having 2 control-centers in Unity7
16:26 <willcooke> I will add that bug to the Trello board and we can get someone assigned
16:26 <seb128> well uoa is deprecated so it wouldn't be 2 in artful
16:26 <seb128> willcooke, thanks
16:26 <jbicha> right, UOA is gone but GOA is a gnome-control-center panel
16:26 <seb128> right :-/
16:27 <seb128> let's do another meeting about unity7
16:27 <seb128> it's too much to discuss today
16:27 <seb128> maybe meanwhile list issues on a wiki or bugtag them
16:27 <jbicha> it is possible to run Unity7 without unity-settings-daemon but a few things don't work (some media-keys shortcuts, gnome-control-center's displays panel, etc.)
16:28 <willcooke> ok, going to close this meeting now.  Seb, let's talk i386 next week.  We can carry on this discussion in a moment ^
16:29 <willcooke> seb128 is going to email Robert
16:29 <kenvandine> cool
16:29 <willcooke> We need to look at that libinput stuff again
16:29 <willcooke> and then we can decide what to do with U7
16:29 <willcooke> Is that right?
16:30 <jbicha> yes
16:30 <willcooke> :) thanks jbicha
16:30 <willcooke> in which case...
16:30 <willcooke> #endmeeting